$$ to download?
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| Author | Content |
|---|---|
| devnet May 20, 2005 11:09 AM EDT |
Thank you God and thank you Almighty Dollar. You hit the nail on the head on how to get churches interested in Linux. Dollar Bills. Never underestimate the power money has in organized religion. Either saving money through using Linux or getting it for downloading this garbage. Bah...what a crock. This belongs in a Church newsletter, not on Lxer.com |
| richo123 May 20, 2005 12:28 PM EDT |
Yeah I agree! Wot next apt-get install rightwinglooney ? |
| devnet May 20, 2005 12:36 PM EDT |
depends on who the rightwinglooney is that you're trying to install ;) |
| dave May 20, 2005 1:54 PM EDT |
I didn't see you complaining about the islamic use of Linux. ?? |
| Abe May 20, 2005 3:16 PM EDT |
Stop this rubbish guys. Grow up. Everyone is free and entitled to download and use Linux, just the way Kubuntu intends it to be. Or should I say how RMS intends it to be. He happened to be Jewish and I am Muslim. |
| devnet May 20, 2005 5:22 PM EDT |
uh...what? I just think it's funny that the guy is charging to download his "Penguin in the Pew" now. THAT to me is rubbish. |
| Abe May 20, 2005 7:11 PM EDT |
If you meant the guy is using religion to make money, I agree with you, I think it is very low of him. Rubbish is to bring religion into the discussion. Dave's comment is out of line. It is ignorant people who give religion a bad rap. This is a technical site and that is how it should stay. Religion is very personal and should not be discussed lightly. Religion does not make people bad, bad people make religion look bad. |
| dcparris May 21, 2005 4:21 PM EDT |
>I just think it's funny that the guy is charging to download his "Penguin in the >Pew" now. THAT to me is rubbish. Why? Everywhere you turn, people say that the "free" in free software refers to "free speech", not "free beer". The FSF even pushes the idea that people can charge a fee for libre software. So if someone charges a fee, how is that wrong? The book's license still allows free redistribution. Read the license for yourself. Additionally, you might want to spend some time reading the GNU philosophy pages. It seems like you've missed the point. > If you meant the guy is using religion to make money, I agree with you, I >think it is very low of him. And how would devnet, or anyone else, know what the author's motive is? I suggest you ask the author. Pushing one's religion on another in a technical forum should certainly be taboo. Discussing the use of technology in a religious organization should be perfectly reasonable. That is what "Penguin in the Pew" is about - using technology in religious organizations. While it is aimed at Christians (given the author is clergy), the lessons could easily apply across the lines of faith. Regards, evangelinux |
| devnet May 21, 2005 5:49 PM EDT |
evangelinux Who cares what his motive is? He's charging cash...no need to know the why...just the fact that you pay to read. Enough said. |
| dinotrac May 21, 2005 6:31 PM EDT |
devnet - what freakin' planet do you live on? For the record: I charge money for the work I do. I'd be willing to bet that most of the people on this forum do the same. For the life of me, I cannot imagine why it should bother you that somebody make money from writing a book -- which, by the way, takes some work to write. Is it because he's a pastor, and his area of expertise centers on church organizations? If so, why should that make any difference? My pastor has a book out, too. Should I be mad at him? And who in the heck are you to tell me something like that? |
| Abe May 21, 2005 8:09 PM EDT |
The issue is not whether the GPL does or doesn't allow charging money, we all know it does. The issue is charging other charitable organizations. In my opinion, it is not ethical and I think it is against the Christian believes. If the recipient chooses to donate, that is a different matter. What is next, churches going into business (make money)? Never mind! many already are. |
| devnet May 21, 2005 9:08 PM EDT |
Abe, Thanks for spelling it out for all those people above. |
| dinotrac May 22, 2005 2:33 PM EDT |
Abe and devnet - Put quite simply: You are both wrong. First, as being against Christian beliefs, I would appreciate a cite on that. Nothing in my bible says anything of the sort. If you'd like, I'll be glad to check with the elders at my church, but I'm betting they wouldn't have a problem with it either. If you've ever worked with/in/for a church, you will know that many people and organizations market products and services to them. This is not remotely unethical. At my church, for example, we purchase lesson guides, scores, music, etc for children's musical productions, music, all manner of things. If we couldn't buy them, we'd have to a) figure out how to do it ourselves or b) do without. Given that we only have so much time and talent, b) would be the usual answer. Frankly, I'm glad that people put their time and talent to use in ways that make our church work better with the resources we have. |
| PaulFerris May 22, 2005 5:31 PM EDT |
chiming in with Dinotrac. Yes, I have to wonder how my Father's churches ever made it without people giving them money and without paying for things like sunday school materials, bibles and the like. Oh, and Dad made a living as a minister. The fact that they want to charge for something. And I thought the article belonged squrely on the newswire -- I'm going to share it with my Dad. |
| devnet May 22, 2005 6:11 PM EDT |
dinotrac, you are wrong. Period. There are plenty of religions that make it without tithing, without paying their 'ministers' and all the nonsense you spewed. In this case, passing around his 'offering plate' is just plain wrong. What about people who can't afford to purchase his pew? Do they just have to suffer? Ridiculous |
| dinotrac May 22, 2005 6:49 PM EDT |
devnet - And what is it I am wrong about? You and Abe made some goofy claims about this pastor's acts being un-Christian. If you're going to say something like that, it helps to have an inkling of what you're talking about. As to charging money for your services, if that is a foreign concept to you, then I suspect you are still letting Daddy pay your bills. |
| dcparris May 22, 2005 11:19 PM EDT |
(1) Devnet, your statement that the author's motive doesn't matter is very telling. The only reason motive is not important is that some people are simply used to getting their libre stuff gratis. Otherwise, please explain - with evidence - *how* the guy is "using religion" to make money. Selling sugar pills on the pretext that they'll get you into Heaven is a misuse of relgion to make money. However, it's quite ethical (within the realm of Christianity) to sell a book on church administration, or how to deploy LOSS in a religious organization. (2) The book IS freely redistributable - you can pass along copies to others. Again, read the license. I noticed you ignored that part. I think you just wanted a good holy war. (3) It seems that some are confusing the author with his ministry. A Christian pastor (can't speak for other faiths) is ethically and legally free to charge a fee for any books (s)he writes. The church could ask for donations. He could, too, for that matter. It would be wrong for his church to charge a fee - that would make his church a business. Since they are a legal non-profit entity, it doesn't seem likely they would risk losing that. |
| Abe May 23, 2005 10:05 AM EDT |
Now you see why in my original post I was not in favor of discussing religion. Like I said, it is a personal matter. As much as I love to answer your posts now, I can't since I am at work and it has to be later tonight from home. Religion and politics discussions never end, but I will give it a try. I am sure we will keep this civil and intellectual. |
| PaulFerris May 23, 2005 10:18 AM EDT |
Abe: yes, that is the key. Looking over my last post, I have a bit too much capital in Christianity (though I try to remove it, it cannot be helped). It's hard for me not to see a difference. See: http://www.varlinux.org/vl/html/modules/stories/article.php?... For more. --FeriCyde |
| devnet May 23, 2005 10:34 AM EDT |
Dino, Never once did I say unchristian my friend. Guess you had me confused with some other devnet. Evangalinux, Doesn't matter if you can redistribute...doesn't matter if he plans on pocketing the money or giving back to his cause. What matters to me is the fact that he is charging for it. Period. I have yet to bring religion into this conversation. It seems that everyone is very intent upon doing this. Thus far, NONE of my posts say anything about anyone's specific religion or whether they are right or wrong...or whether or not what this guy is doing is morally sound or not. I don't care about it at all...I just hate the fact that someone has to pay money now for something that was once free. Bitkeeper anyone? |
| dinotrac May 23, 2005 5:22 PM EDT |
devnet - Well then, that's ok. You can forgive me, then, for being a bit confused as to what you meant by: >Abe, > Thanks for spelling it out for all those people above. as Abe did offer an opinion on that topic. I guess you were just incorporating the general point, not the specifics. In that case, we still disagree, but a little disagreement keeps things interesting. |
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