I agree with RMS

Story: Cloud computing is a trap, warns GNU founder Richard StallmanTotal Replies: 23
Author Content
garymax

Sep 30, 2008
11:26 AM EST
I agree wuth RMS. The cloud computing paradigm takes too many of our freedoms away and does lock us into one way of doing our computing. Hopefully this trend will pass soon.
azerthoth

Sep 30, 2008
11:48 AM EST
I agree with garymax and RMS.

There is no freedom unless it's freedom solely as we define it. Choice is irrelevant, only our definition of freedom is pertinent.

/sarcasm

BTW I have stated before that cloud computing is for the birds on many technical levels IMHO.
bigg

Sep 30, 2008
12:48 PM EST
> Hopefully this trend will pass soon.

The trend is only in the articles, not actual computing.
Steven_Rosenber

Sep 30, 2008
1:19 PM EST
I think the key is to leverage FOSS in the cloud. If we ignore the cloud, it won't go away. I think it's a good idea to bring open standards and software to the cloud so we're not left on the sidelines if and when this model for storage and applications takes off.

I'd love to have the option in OpenOffice to edit cloud-based documents, for instance. This feature might already be there, for all I know.
dinotrac

Sep 30, 2008
1:34 PM EST
I have no problem with the cloud per se.

For some things, it could really be handy, especially in an on-the-go world, but...

We have to be remember that the cloud is just a convenience, like pre-loaded Windows.

It can go very, very wrong.

In the case of Windows, lots of people tied themselves to Microsoft and got screwed along the way.

Anyone who makes the same mistake with the cloud deserves what they get.

theboomboomcars

Sep 30, 2008
2:15 PM EST
What I don't understand about cloud computing is why do we want to base our computing on some as transient and unpredictable as a cloud?
hchaudh1

Sep 30, 2008
2:28 PM EST
I don't know exactly how we define "cloud computing".

There are services like Amazon's EC2 which basically allow you a lot of flexibility, right down to be able to install your own OS on their infrastructure. Then there are other "cloud" providers like force.com which even have their own "cloud" language. As far as I understand, the former should be ok, not the latter though.

Can someone throw more light on this?
tuxchick

Sep 30, 2008
2:41 PM EST
As far as I can tell, cloud computing is just the latest buzzphrase for hosted services. Which is like so radical and innovative we should all be peeing ourselves with delight. That's the impression I get from the meelyuns of press releases killing my inbox, at any rate.
dinotrac

Sep 30, 2008
3:32 PM EST
Hey TC ---

I've got a great new business idea...

We'll create a new cloud. It won't be quite as fancy as some of the current cloud stuff, but that's part of it's charm: just about any device will be able to use it because it's resource demands will be tiny.

There will be lots of services and lots of communities, all available on a pay-as-you-go basis so we won't have to bug people with, or sacrifice bandwidth to, advertising.

Mostly though, it will be all about social networking, only better. Better how? Because you are freed from the limitations of your hardware. Social networking is broken down into its elemental form -- individuals and communities, interacting in a great cloud of ether, no looks, unencumbered by trivial nothings like appearance, economic status, race, or gender.

As individuals cluster around new activiites and interests, new communities will naturally grow.

We'll call it Compuserve.

Once we get that going, I have this idea for something I call the internet...
Steven_Rosenber

Sep 30, 2008
3:38 PM EST
That's part of the problem: At this point, "cloud computing" means different things to different people and is ill-defined overall.
tracyanne

Sep 30, 2008
3:55 PM EST
Quoting:As far as I can tell, cloud computing is just the latest buzzphrase for hosted services.


The more things change the more they stay the same.
NoDough

Oct 01, 2008
9:57 AM EST
From wikipedia:

"Cloud computing is Internet ('cloud') based development and use of computer technology ('computing')."

So, would the Storm botnet then be the "Storm Cloud"?
azerthoth

Oct 01, 2008
10:00 AM EST
"The strength of the pun is in the oy of the beholder"

That one was a 6 out of 10 on hold your nose and run from the room.
NoDough

Oct 01, 2008
10:34 AM EST
Victory! :)
gus3

Oct 01, 2008
11:19 AM EST
And you know that the next time some marketroid dweeb starts pratting on about the joy that is cloud computing, you'll pull out NoDough's question and jam a monkey wrench into his mental gears.
garymax

Oct 01, 2008
1:08 PM EST
There is a reason it's called the "cloud".

Your data exits your computer and disappears into what is usually illustrated as a gray circle. The end user shouldn't care where or how their data is processed, the pundits say, only that it is processed. It is transparent to the end user.

Does this sound as if your information is safe and under your full control? There should be a sign on the edge of the cloud that says "Abandon all hope of security and privacy all ye bits who enter here."

This cloud computing thing may sound convenient but we must never allow it to totally replace what we have now. We should always have a choice in how, when, and where we do our computing. And the tools we use to do it.
hchaudh1

Oct 01, 2008
2:30 PM EST
Speaking of clouds: http://www.computerworld.com/action/article.do?command=viewA...
tuxchick

Oct 01, 2008
3:06 PM EST
You guys are ruining my life. Now I have this earworm stuck in my head from a Mexican soap I saw years ago- one of the characters was Claudia, and they pronounced it CLOUD-ia. In sexy deep Mexican voices.

Despite all the annoying hype, buzzwords, and obvious pitfalls, software-as-a-service is going to catch on. A lot of folks will be happy to pay a monthly fee to let someone else do the backend work, so all they have to do is log in and Do Stuff.
Steven_Rosenber

Oct 01, 2008
4:30 PM EST
I think the key to SAAS is being able to interact with the cloud via small apps/widgets (or large apps) that are NOT necessarily the browser or part of it.

I'm not quite sure what Microsoft has planned in this regard, since they're doing a poor job of explaining it, but the ability to share documents in the cloud but use your traditional apps (like MS Office in their case) to do so is what's going to happen next in this space.

That's why I think FOSS apps like OpenOffice need to start adding cloud-based functionality so they won't be left behind, whatever RMS thinks about it.
Sander_Marechal

Oct 01, 2008
5:21 PM EST
Quoting:That's why I think FOSS apps like OpenOffice need to start adding cloud-based functionality so they won't be left behind


It's Linux. It's network transparent. OOo + Apache + WebDAV = instant cloud. See ODF@WWW and check the video: http://blogs.sun.com/GullFOSS/entry/odf_www_an_odf_wiki
jezuch

Oct 02, 2008
1:00 AM EST
I don't care about these clouds... All I can think about is who'll be the first to start a project named "Cumulonimbus". Or Nibostratus. Or Cirrus.

Oh, that last one's already taken. Dang! Cirrostratus it is, then.
Steven_Rosenber

Oct 02, 2008
12:51 PM EST
Quoting:It's Linux. It's network transparent. OOo + Apache + WebDAV = instant cloud. See ODF@WWW and check the video: [HYPERLINK@blogs.sun.com]


Sander, that looks like something that's in the ballpark.

I think that the FOSS community is uniquely able to take advantage of the cloud framework and modify existing apps (or even build new ones) to tap into it.

Jungle Disk — http://jungledisk.com/index.aspx — is one solution that facilitates backups to the Amazon S3 Storage Service (for Windows, OS X and Linux). There's a lot of FOSS in there (see the release notes — http://jungledisk.com/desktop/releasenotes.aspx — and go to the bottom for the licensing information).

While I might just pay up, I think a full FOSS solution should exist (even if somebody requests the full source of Jungle Disk and releases it as a free app).
Sander_Marechal

Oct 02, 2008
5:07 PM EST
Quoting:While I might just pay up, I think a full FOSS solution should exist


There's plenty to choose from. OpenAFS, Lustre, Hadoop, NFS 4.1, GFS, etcetera, etcetera. And even here you could use WebDAV.

FOSS doesn't lack any component to build the cloud. All we need is some integration.
Steven_Rosenber

Oct 02, 2008
6:21 PM EST
Sander, you know more about this than I do, and it seems that the cloud is already pretty much built on FOSS, just like all the businesses (Amazon, Google) building it.

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