Brazilian chix face an uphill battle
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| Author | Content |
|---|---|
| tuxchick Jan 03, 2007 11:16 AM EDT |
The stories I've heard from Brazilian women are pretty horrendous. Apparently machismo is alive and well down yonder, to the point that when LinuxChix Brasil was founded it caused some real problems for the women involved. Hurrah for them for not backing down. |
| jimf Jan 03, 2007 1:06 PM EDT |
> The stories I've heard from Brazilian women are pretty horrendous. A close friend of mine ended up doing a lot of support in Brazil. He confurms the machismo attitude. Sufice it to say that women's rights are sometimes iffy in a lot of the world outside of the US and Europe. |
| dcparris Jan 03, 2007 2:50 PM EDT |
My mother's experience seems to have proven fairly ironic. She left West Virginia because of all the machismo there. She started off in the Fairfax, VA area, but eventually went to England. She has actually accomplished some very high-level projects in the HR & management consulting field. Still, when she went to work for HBSC, she wound up training the guy who became her Boss. Some of it is sex, some of it is age now, too. She's pretty much "too qualified". She has done some work in Brazil, btw. Do foreign women get more credence in Brazil than local women? I ask because she seemed to really like it there. Anyway, I hope the best for the Brazilian chix! |
| jimf Jan 03, 2007 3:11 PM EDT |
Well, I wasn't saying that Europe and the US are perfect either. I've always wondered how one half of the human race deserves to be put down by the other anyway. It's really sad wherever it occurs. |
| rijelkentaurus Jan 03, 2007 3:17 PM EDT |
>I've always wondered how one half of the human race deserves to be put down by the other anyway Having my baby happy makes me happy. Very happy ;). I can't see a reason to want to put her down or treat her like a second-class citizen. She has to be an equal...I couldn't be with her if she wasn't my equal, or if she didn't want to be my equal. When any group wants to put down another group, they have to expend MASSIVE resources to make it happen. The South could have been a great place, but the whites spent a god-awful amount of time and money to make sure it didn't happen and that blacks were "kept in their proper place," which ultimately failed anyway. Shoot, we'd be on Vega now if we worked together and stopped using our resources against ourselves. |
| dcparris Jan 03, 2007 3:27 PM EDT |
Well, I meant to add that, had she stayed in Clarksburg, she might actually have been better off in the long run. My wife is a homemaker (thanks in large part to her health). However, if it wasn't for her, I would probably not be able to do LXer, since I would have to do: laundry, dishes, dust, vacuum, run errands and cook (more likely stop at a restaurant on the way to work). That makes her the other most important person in our house. :-) At work, the IT gals seem to command a fair amount of respect. At least when asked, they seem to feel they get treated fairly well. They do acknowledge that things could improve, but are generally quite happy. Of course, the office is a top-notch environment for employees, generally. I know one lady who did temp work as the front desk receptionist, and she calls back every now and then trying to find out about openings. And most people who come seem to stay for extended periods. Heck, even I like it. |
| DarrenR114 Jan 03, 2007 4:03 PM EDT |
dcparris - got any openings for a code jockey? |
| dcparris Jan 03, 2007 4:16 PM EDT |
Well, apparently there is, for a Senior Systems Programmer. I'm guessing the mainframe, running OpenVMS and something else. Would that be up your alley? |
| DarrenR114 Jan 03, 2007 4:33 PM EDT |
DC - I haven't *touched* VMS in over 15 years. Back then, I was more of a TSO/ISPF guy with JCL and IDMS COBOL. It was an MVS environment. Besides the IBM 370s, there were a few DEC VAX in the mix. That actually was close to my earliest experience with Telnet and VI. Once I understood that VI was designed so you never had to take your hands off of the keyboard "home row," it was a breeze to work with. I have yet to embrace Emacs. You stated "OpenVMS and something else" ... may I have a hint about the something else? Darren |
| tuxchick Jan 03, 2007 5:06 PM EDT |
Cobol. |
| DarrenR114 Jan 03, 2007 5:19 PM EDT |
TC: IDMS - yummy ... http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/IDMS Can you guess which IDMS customer listed in that article that I worked for at the time? hint: I was dealing with SIOP |
| dcparris Jan 03, 2007 6:04 PM EDT |
Darren, here: [url=http://jobsearch.nationalgypsum.newjobs.com/getjob.asp?JobID=50995487&AVSDM=2006-11-30 14:26:20&Logo=0&col=dltc&sort=rv&vw=b&fn=660]http://jobsearch.nationalgypsum.newjobs.com/getjob.asp?JobID...[/url] See how that floats your boat. It's SMP/E - I can't remember VMS fits in. |
| tuxchick Jan 03, 2007 6:42 PM EDT |
Darren, I can't even guess. All the acronyms and abbreviations confused my brain! |
| jimf Jan 03, 2007 7:01 PM EDT |
> acronyms Arrg! Don't get me started :P |
| dcparris Jan 03, 2007 7:32 PM EDT |
It works like this, The CRM is run by SAP, which ties into the OpenVMS that resides on the SMP/E, where they also run and ADABAS DB from SAG, and program using NATURAL. I think you can choose EMACS or VIM for your editor. :-p |
| jimf Jan 03, 2007 7:47 PM EDT |
ok, my eyes are glaized over %-) |
| jdixon Jan 03, 2007 7:51 PM EDT |
> Apparently machismo is alive and well down yonder... I understand that's largely true all across Latin America. It's a cultural thing. :( One that could easily be solved with large quantities of handguns and the appropriate training, but that's another discussion. :) |
| jimf Jan 03, 2007 7:55 PM EDT |
> It's a cultural thing Seems like everyone uses that as an excuse ;-) |
| Sander_Marechal Jan 03, 2007 9:38 PM EDT |
Quoting:It works like this, The CRM is run by SAP, which ties into the OpenVMS that resides on the SMP/E, where they also run and ADABAS DB from SAG, and program using NATURAL. I think you can choose EMACS or VIM for your editor. :-p Scary. I can actually understand that. And I'm only 27! |
| dcparris Jan 03, 2007 10:52 PM EDT |
I'm surprised it made any sense at all! jimf: Everything is cultural these days. I mean relative. I mean relatively cultural. I mean, I really should go to bed. These poinsettias are making my head spin. Seriously, though. What drives me nuts is that the Brazilian Chix are travelling together, and here, I can't seem to find two women interested enough in GNU/Linux to come to the CharLUG meeting. Sigh! Women around here all seem to be Windows girlz. I know, I know - I need to advertise far and wide. I also need to look into some different venues. Yeah, I'm kind of rambling. |
| DarrenR114 Jan 04, 2007 3:31 AM EDT |
tc - Strategic Air Command (SAC) - which was part the Air Force. Actually, when I was working with SIOP (Single Integrated Operational Plan), I was attached to JSTPS (Joint Strategic Target Planning Staff) which was a combined agency consisting of Air Force, Navy and Army staff. It was hosted at SAC Headquarters. Back in '92 (or thereabouts) JSTPS was reorganised into STRATCOM (Strategic Command), and SAC merged with TAC (Tactical Air Command) to become Air Combat Command. PS - I tried to keep the abbreviations as limited as much as I could in this reply. |
| dcparris Jan 04, 2007 8:47 AM EDT |
I was in the USMC from '85-'91. You can't be all bad, having served, even if it was in the wrong branch of service. ;-) |
| azerthoth Jan 04, 2007 9:46 AM EDT |
Come to work for the FAA, we have recursive anacronyms as part of composite anacronyms (anacronyms for other anacronyms). Its so bad that we actually have a fairly hefty book that we use to decipher them. You all thought FAA was Federal Aviation Adminitstration, in reality its Forever Abusing Anacronyms. |
| tuxchick Jan 04, 2007 9:54 AM EDT |
Don, the reason getting women Linux geeks together is difficult is there are so few of them. In the proprietary tech world, something like 20% of coders are women. In FOSS, about 1.5%. For system and network administrators the numbers are higher, but still tiny. So you're starting from a much smaller pool of people to invite to a LUG meeting or other event. With any kind of group it's a numbers game. 100 people hear about you, 10 give you a try, one or two stick around to participate. People come, people go. If you really really want to attract women to your LUG it's going to take some work. You could post meeting announcements on the Linuxchix Announce list http://www.linuxchix.org/content/docs/listinfo.html. Word will spread over time. The things that attract women are not painting the meeting room pink or learning to program Barbie dolls, but things like: -meetings in a safe neighborhood with easy parking -real food, rather than beer and pizza (if you have food) -nice folks with actual manners that are fun to be with -post-meeting hangouts that are not dirty smoky beer dives, and that serve a variety of food and non-alcoholic drinks Really, nothing radical- just the same things that make most people feel comfortable. These days most folks don't smoke, and watch what they eat, and don't like getting mugged. Reaching out to noobs and the "Linux curious" will probably reach more people than any other approach. Linuxchix grew up around a core of women geeks who were fed up with macho crap, and wanted a civilized hangout. My guess that currently it's about 60/40 women/men, and it is quite a fine place to hangout. |
| rijelkentaurus Jan 04, 2007 9:57 AM EDT |
>These days most folks don't smoke, and watch what they eat. I quit smoking...but not that last bit. |
| jdixon Jan 04, 2007 10:00 AM EDT |
> real food, rather than beer and pizza Hey, pizza is real food. If it wasn't, how could you gain weight from it? |
| tuxchick Jan 04, 2007 10:07 AM EDT |
Pizza is the official food of the gods, no doubt about it. Good pizza, that is, not Domino's or Pizza Hut or Godfather's. Cheaper by the square yard doesn't make it taste better. |
| jimf Jan 04, 2007 10:22 AM EDT |
> Pizza is the official food of the gods Well, that's it then :). If you visit Kenosha, you're getting treated to a Tenuta's pizza. I've had the best pizza in New York & Chicago, but Tenuta's is better than any of them. |
| tuxchick Jan 04, 2007 11:27 AM EDT |
Is that like Judy Tenuta? Do you get insulted with every order? "I dated a man like you once, only he had a human head." "Friends are just enemies who don't have the guts to kill you." |
| jimf Jan 04, 2007 2:02 PM EDT |
> Is that like Judy Tenuta? Well, I really hadn't thought about it, but no relation that I know, although Kenosha was a mob center during the 20's... Seriously, Kenosha has an old and established Italian community. Tenuta's is an Icon, but no Chicago typewriters now, just good eats :) |
| rijelkentaurus Jan 04, 2007 3:45 PM EDT |
> Pizza is the official food of the gods And beer is the drink. To quote Ben Franklin, "Beer is proof that God loves us and wants us to be happy.” |
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