Pentium 133s
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| Author | Content |
|---|---|
| rht Jan 06, 2007 11:53 AM EDT |
If you're looking for a firewall appliance, why waste CPU cycles on a P133? For years my SOHO firewall was an IBM P75 (the best early Pentium chip made) running IPCop. Now, my IPCop firewall lives contently on a Pentium Pro 200 -- but I only upgraded because the PPro box is a rackmount. Protected by a UPS, the firewall box gets turned off only during severe, close, thunderstorms -- about three times a year. I've been thinking of upgrading the firewall to a P333 that I have. But that machine's not a spare, it's my Web server and mail server. P133 -- such overkill :-) |
| techiem2 Jan 06, 2007 12:02 PM EDT |
haha.
Sadly, my firewall/router is a Duron 700 cuz that's what I had available when I built it. :)
Wish I could dig up an older machine to use instead so I could set that up with something more appropriate for it's power. |
| jimf Jan 06, 2007 12:13 PM EDT |
While you're at it techiem, Athlon 700s are a big $22. |
| jdixon Jan 06, 2007 12:16 PM EDT |
Ours was a 486-66 for years, then moved to a K6/2-500 when it died. Since we got DSL, it's now a Dlink wireless router, which has a NAT firewall built in. |
| cr Jan 06, 2007 12:52 PM EDT |
My firewall's an IBM P75. Apache/http transfers on the LAN lag a bit at that clockrate, so my servers are [P133 .. P233MMX]. Anything faster here usually isn't a server, meaning that it's not up 24/7, only when actually in use. I could see a faster machine here for a LAMP/MediaWiki install on the LAN (it bogs noticeably on a P133), but so far anything I could do with MediaWiki I can do with UseMod Wiki (less pretty formatting, but simpler, non-MySQL, and in Perl)... I watch the watts carefully around here, at least casually thinking QRPp. |
| techiem2 Jan 06, 2007 1:01 PM EDT |
Yeah, I started with a 486-25 (gave it to a friend for a dialup router when I didn't need it anymore), then used a low end pentium or some such (don't remember exactly, but it's in the basement as my backup router). Those ran Freesco linux (great little distro).
Then I switched to the Duron with a full gentoo install cuz minimal features wasn't cutting in anymore since I needed more flexibility with my router. One of the best lessons I learned through my first change from dialup to broadband (dsl at the time, now I'm on cable since we moved), was to run your own dns server so you don't have to rely on the ISP's dns server reliability/caching updates. Our dsl connection (from a certain large provider) was horribly unreliable for quite a while (pages would load, then not load, then load..you know how that is - but the connection was supposedly still alive). My friend watched their dns servers and found out that they were going down on average every half our. It didn't take long for me to learn how to setup an in house dns server so we didn't have to rely on those anymore (and amazingly the net became much more reliable as a result!). :) Course, things are probably better these days, but I still like not having to depend on them. |
| cr Jan 06, 2007 1:32 PM EDT |
>One of the best lessons I learned through my first change from dialup to broadband (dsl at the time, now I'm on cable since we moved), was to run your own dns server so you don't have to rely on the ISP's dns server reliability/caching updates. I run dnsmasq on the firewall, and have ever since we were dialup-only. It does local resolving using /etc/hosts and passes on other queries when the Net's up (and nobody sits through DNS timeouts when it's not), plus serves an MX record for my LAN's qmail server. I keep it pointed at OpenDNS servers since Earthlink decided to run broken DNS just to throw up ad pages. One of these days I'll study up on BIND and do a full implementation like you've done, but there's too much other stuff to do, and so far dnsmasq Just Works. |
| jdixon Jan 06, 2007 1:37 PM EDT |
> and so far dnsmasq Just Works. Dnsmasq is the best thing since sliced bread for the home DNS user. |
| techiem2 Jan 06, 2007 1:37 PM EDT |
Quoting:but there's too much other stuff to do, If only there were 48 hours in a day and life was free..... My setup could use some tweaking here and there. But it works pretty well. I still need to tweak it so my no-ip domain name for my web server works from inside the lan (for some reason firewalls don't like sending out requests that loop right back to them....). But I think that's a minor issue, I just haven't gotten around to playing with it and testing it around the lan. I just have it listed in hosts for the machine that accesses it frequently. |
| tuxtom Jan 06, 2007 5:58 PM EDT |
There is absolutely no economy in using older PC's for a firewall appliance as the power cost to run it would easily buy you and embedded-os firewall/router in a matter of months. I hang my old motherboards up on the wall as art and give the old cases (which could be used to anchor a boat) to naive junk collectors. I used to do things with older hardware and linux, but it is pointless and academic in most cases in these days of cheap, efficient hardware. There are much more important things to do in life. |
| jdixon Jan 06, 2007 6:24 PM EDT |
> There is absolutely no economy in using older PC's for a firewall appliance as the power cost to run it would easily buy you and embedded-os firewall/router in a matter of months. That may not be true if you're a dialup user. Our Dlink wireless router cost us about $20 (it's 802.11b, which is why it was so cheap), but it only supports broadband. That's true of all of the other devices which were less than $100 I could find. Do you know of any such device which supports dialup, either via an onboard or serial port attached modem? |
| Sander_Marechal Jan 07, 2007 3:47 PM EDT |
> I watch the watts carefully around here How do you do that? I've got an old HP NetServer LC3 (dual PII 233 Mhz) running 24/7 around here. I hope to replace it by a Dual Xeon 3.2 Ghz soon. But I haven't the slightest idea what it actually costs me to keep them running 24/7. |
| azerthoth Jan 07, 2007 5:48 PM EDT |
Here is one way: http://www.electronicproducts.com/ShowPage.asp?SECTION=3700&... Another requires a little test equipment, namely your average VOM set up to measure current (Amps). Turn off the appropriate breaker first. Get 2 wire nuts, open up the wall socket that your compuer is plugged into and unhook the hot lead from the socket. Wire nut the wire onto one lead of your VOM, wire nut a short chunk of wire (rated for 120v 15a) to the other lead and put it into where the hot lead came from. Plug the computer back in to the socket and turn the breaker back on. Volts times Amps = Watts. So once you know the amp draw you can calculate it out. If you dont have any idea of what I just said dont try it, you could kill yourself or burn down your house. They also make clamp on amp meters, but they arent as accurate as the manufacturers would like you to believe. |
| techiem2 Jan 07, 2007 6:46 PM EDT |
Well, I just turned off the old box running freebsd that was my frisbee testing server since I got the copy running in vmware server on another box working as I wanted.
Namely, I figured out why the remote console wasn't working.
(I typed only-from instead of only_from in the xinetd vmware auth config, thus invalidating that line so it was reverting to the default of only allow localhost. duh.) That should save a little wattage (I was also using the freebsd box as my ssh portal into the lan from outside, so I had to tweak my dhcp so the vm copy would get the righ IP). |
| Sander_Marechal Jan 07, 2007 9:57 PM EDT |
> Here is one way: Hmm... i'll see if I can borrow such a thing. $200,- is a bit much for me ATM. |
| cr Jan 08, 2007 3:56 AM EDT |
> How do you do that? 1. Get a VOM that's got a 10-amp AC setting; you can't use a DC range for this. For this exercise, you'll tape the switch down with electrical or duct tape so it can't budge from that setting -- at these currents and voltages mistakes can be damaging or fatal. Assuming the VOM has banana jacks (RTFM to be sure: the current has to pass through the VOM in order to be measured and an incorrect setup can burn out your meter)... 2. Get two insulated banana plugs (the kind that have a plastic sleeve and a screw wire-clamp). Verify that your banana plugs will go all the way into the correct jacks on your VOM. While you're at it, get a sleeve-style dual inline banana jack (an insulated sleeve which takes a banana plug at each end) -- that's a safety holster for those plugs for when you're not measuring currents and you need just one little extension cord; the inline jack is so your haste won't kill you or burn down your house. 3. Get a flat three-wire extension cord, the shorter the better. For these purposes (measuring a computer's draw), a 3-amp cord will probably do you, but a 5- or 6-amp one is better. A 10-amp or 15-amp one probably won't do, because the wires will be so thick that you'll have trouble fitting them into the banana plugs. 4. Cut the hot lead (the black wire, connected to the narrow spade of the 3-pin plug, in US wiring) of the extension cord, about halfway down its length. Verify that that's the wire you cut, by testing continuity between ends: the narrow spade's lead should no longer conduct. Strip, form and tip-tin the cut ends just enough to make connection and stay put when clamped into place in the banana plugs. Attach the banana plugs firmly to the wire ends. Plug them into the inline sleeve and verify low-resistance continuity. 5. Plug the banana plugs into the correct jacks on your VOM for 10-amp-AC-range measurement. Set the rotary switch to that range and tape it down so it can't budge. 6. One device at a time, unplug the device from the wall socket or power strip, plug it into your measurement setup, plug that into the power source, and take your measurements. For safety, unplug the measurement setup from the power source first at the conclusion of each test. 7. Turn the device on, while watching the meter. The highest value the meter needle kicks up to is the peak load, which is always greatest at power-up when large capacitors are waiting to be charged and drive motors are at stall. Peak values matter if you're figuring out how to power your systems off-grid; otherwise it's the maximum average load that matters, and that comes when the system has brought up the graphics layer, so your fancy video card is getting a workout and earning its heatsink, but is not yet at the sign-in prompt, because that's when the system is still seeking around the HD a lot to pull stuff in and set it up. If that period is too short, measure things just after a valid signin, when all your account's configuration details are being brought in and implemented and the system is painting up a desktop for you. If the machine doesn't have X installed, of course, the video card will never go into overdrive, so the maximum average load is during the boot-up scroll. As Azerthoth said, "Volts times Amps = Watts. So once you know the amp draw you can calculate it out." For these purposes, assume that voltage is 120 VAC. Remember, you have just read instructions posted for free on the Internet: they're worth only what you paid for them and there is no warranty. |
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