Need some advice on laptop video selection...
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| Author | Content |
|---|---|
| nicsmr Apr 09, 2008 7:20 PM EDT |
Hi there, I'm looking for a bit of advice. I will be attending Bellingham's Linuxfest NW later on this month and, since prices are way better in the States and our dollar doesn't suck any more, I will be buying a laptop there probably at Bestbuy or Circuit City. I'm tracking 3 or 4 laptops that are presently attractively priced (450$-600$). 1 toshibas, 1 dell, 1 gateway and 1 compaq (nvidia). Of course by the time I get there different laptops may be on sale. I've been reading stuff on several web sites and forums about nvidia and ati and how one plays better with linux than the other. I'm looking at at least 1g of memory (possibly 2g), large hard disk, PCIMCIA slot (for my Dlink nic that I know works). DVD/CD RW dual layer etc. Built in webcam not necessary but nice to have. SVideo out a bonus if available since part of the function of this machine will be a media centre. Since this is a good opportunity for me to get a laptop that I will dedicate to linux I don't want to blow it. I guess what is really bugging me is this video thing. NVIDIA OR ATI? One of the laptops has Nvidia the rest ATI. The ATI laptops have a few more features than the Nvidia one that would be nice to have. Will there be a great performance hit if I choose ATI over Nvidia? I will be using this laptop to edit music, convert vhs tapes to DVD and develop web sites and apps. A real multi purpose machine. Feel free to comment on any of the machines or choices, I know you will any ways. Any advice would be greatly appreciated and thanks in advance for your help. Nick |
| azerthoth Apr 09, 2008 7:42 PM EDT |
100% nVidia, I spend alot of time doing irc support and 9 times out of 10 if someone is having video card issues it's with an ATI card. |
| helios Apr 09, 2008 8:14 PM EDT |
Dollar for dollar, the best linux laptops on the market today I believe are at zareason.com The prices are more than reasonable, the machines are built when you order them and ZA was Linux before Linux was kool. Most people are moving to Linux machines for profit motive. ZA sells the machines for profit but uses Linux out of principle. I own one of their Megalaps and I couldn't be happier. It dances rings out of the HP machines in the same class. Sure you can buy from Dell, but ZA was doing this long before Dell even thought of it. My laptop came with a gforce 7700 and it rocks my world. The graphics are stunning in 2 and there isn't one glitch with 3D performance even with multiple things going on at once. I'd go with those who care about the community...not the dollars in their wallets. h |
| nicsmr Apr 09, 2008 9:23 PM EDT |
I hear ya Helios but it's the cost. I can get this... * AMD Athlon™ 64 X2 dual-core processor TK-57* with 64-bit platform, HyperTransport™ and AMD PowerNow!™ technologies and Enhanced Virus Protection** * 1GB DDR2 memory for multitasking power, expandable to 2GB * Multiformat DVD±RW/CD-RW drive with double-layer support records up to 8.5GB of data or 4 hours of video using compatible DVD+R DL and DVD-R DL media; supports DVD-RAM; also supports LightScribe direct-disc labels using compatible LightScribe media * AMD dual-core technology enables you to work or play with multiple programs without impacting performance; AMD64 technology provides simultaneous support for 32-bit and 64-bit computing * 15.4" WXGA high-definition widescreen display with BrightView technology and 1280 x 800 resolution * 160GB Serial ATA hard drive (5400 rpm) * NVIDIA GeForce Go 7150M (UMA) graphics with up to 287MB total available graphics memory; S-video TV-out * QuickPlay touch-sensitive music and DVD controls; HP mobile remote and ear bud headphones included * 5-in-1 digital media reader supports Secure Digital, MultiMediaCard, Memory Stick, Memory Stick PRO and xD-Picture Card * IEEE 1394 (FireWire) interface and 3 high-speed USB 2.0 ports for fast digital video, audio and data transfer * Built-in high-speed wireless LAN (802.11b/g); 10/100Base-T Ethernet LAN with RJ-45 connector; 56 Kbps modem; Expansion Port 3 connector * Weighs 5.7 lbs. and measures just 1.6" thin for easy portability; lithium-ion battery and AC adapter * Long-lasting Trace Imprint high-gloss finish with inlaid pattern design and silver interior For 500$. I install linux and gain experience... priceless. I priced out zareason, they're going to be there. the starting price is way more. I just can't afford that. And I hate to say this but I really don't like any flavour of Ubuntu (except maybe MINT). I much prefer DEBIAN, MEPIS or PCLinuxOS. Thanks for the advice thought and now go get some sleep or are you doing some arm bending exercises after a long day at the conference... ;-) Nick |
| Sander_Marechal Apr 09, 2008 10:56 PM EDT |
For the $450-$600 dollar range I'd definitely buy one of the new HP 2133 MiniNote computers: http://www.notebookreview.com/default.asp?newsID=4352 At $549 you get an amazing little machine: http://h10010.www1.hp.com/wwpc/us/en/sm/WF25a/321957-321957-... VIA 1.2 Ghz CPU 1 GiB RAM 120 GiB HDD The only thing that's missing is bluetooth, but you can solve that with a $10 bluetooth dongle. The screen resolution is great at 1280x768 and with a keyboard that's 92% the size of a normal keyboard it's a whole lot less awkward than the Eee to type on. The only complaints I found were that the screen is a tad too glossy. Read the review in my first link for more details. |
| jezuch Apr 10, 2008 3:45 AM EDT |
Quoting:And I hate to say this but I really don't like any flavour of Ubuntu (except maybe MINT). Then *zap* and out goes Ubuntu and in goes Debian. Welcome to the free world! ;) |
| nicsmr Apr 10, 2008 5:58 AM EDT |
Sander... Sounds great but I need a big screen. Jezuch...then there is still the cost. Remember that any laptop I buy will have that wonderful POC Vista installed that I will remove (zap into the free world). My mind, such as it is, is mostly made up the only thing that remains to be solved is the video dilema. I'm leaning towards Nvidia. |
| Sander_Marechal Apr 10, 2008 6:55 AM EDT |
100% Nvidia. Don't touch ATI until the 100% FOSS 3D drivers are finished. Why? Well... http://lxer.com/module/forums/t/26923/ |
| number6x Apr 10, 2008 7:21 AM EDT |
If you want compiz and lots of eye candy, go nvidia. I am using intel 965 chipset (often sold as x3100) I believe. Intel provides solid performance and very good open source support. However, this chipset is problematic with compiz. It will work but it lacks support for some functions (EXA I think) that could make some compiz effects result in instability. The 965 chip also has trouble with a virtual screensize larger than your monitor. I don't miss compiz, but do miss a larger screen. I use this laptop for work not play and am happy with intel. My last laptop was a thinkpad with intel 815 graphics chip and worked great even with compiz. I think the 915 chips support compiz well, but have not used one. If your needs are minimal, the Intel choice is adequate. If you want fancy choose Nvidia. |
| nicsmr Apr 10, 2008 7:39 AM EDT |
Like I said above this will be my at home work PC for music and video importing/editing and creating DVDs as well as web site development and programming. It'll also be what I'll show others in my bid to convert them to Linux so a little bit of WOW power wouldn't hurt. Thanks for the advice, Keep it coming, it's helping. Nick |
| Sander_Marechal Apr 10, 2008 12:08 PM EDT |
I have a Dell laptop with an Intel 945 cip in it. Works perfectly fine with Compiz. Only when I start using the scale plugin with 20 or more open windows does it lag noticeably. But in your case I'd go for an Nvidia. |
| nicsmr Apr 10, 2008 3:11 PM EDT |
Thanks to all that responded to my question. I had a feeling that Nvidia would be the way to go and unless something happens, like a stupendous price difference, that's what I'll go with. All I can do is track the prices on the web, wait till I get to Bellingham and go like the wind through all the store to find my special deal. 2 weeks and counting. Two more questions... Is there a site out there that you how of where different make/models of laptops are confirmed to work with Linux? How does Compaq compare with others? If your interested I'll let you know what I got and the trials & tribulations, if any. Cheers And have a great weekend. Nick |
| Sander_Marechal Apr 10, 2008 3:18 PM EDT |
There are some lists out there but they are outdated before you can scratch the back of your head. The best information is smeared out over a gazillion blogs from people who actually (tried to) use it. Just google for "linux" and the brand/model of the laptop. That's usually your best bet. Personally I can comment only on three models, all Dell Dimensions: The D520 and D610 (intel wireless & graphics) work fine. Some minor tweaking required (see http://www.jejik.com/articles/2007/04/configuring_debian_etc...). The Dell D521 has a lot more problems (ATI graphics, Broadcom wifi and a lot of Live CDs refused to boot). I've also toyed with a Dell XPS 13" laptop. It seemed to work fine but never got around to see if wireless worked. |
| tuxtom Apr 10, 2008 4:32 PM EDT |
One thing to watch out for with that Compaq. I have one from the same line. The video is good but the Broadcomm 802.11 requires ndiswrapper, and there is a DHCP bug with it making it unusable in the current *buntu Gutsy kernel, though it is working with MEPIS. The LAN and everything else is fine. NVIDIA 3d acceleration is A-OK with the restricted driver. Mine was $449 after the rebate...it's really a nice machine. I wish I could go. I went to college in Bellingham and lived there for many years...got my first shell account there at the University...my first laptop (a monochrome COMPAQ 386)...and my first PPP dial up account at 2400 baud. My good friends own a tavern downtown called Cap' Hansens. It's on Chestnut across the street from the Bellingham Herald building. Ask for John or Liz and tell them Tom from San Diego sent ya! They have killer sandwiches even if you don't drink. |
| jdixon Apr 10, 2008 5:35 PM EDT |
> Is there a site out there that you how of where different make/models of laptops are confirmed to work with Linux? http://www.linux-laptop.net/ But, as Sander notes, most of the information is going to be out of date. > How does Compaq compare with others? Compaq = HP. I personally can't stand HP. YMMV. |
| rijelkentaurus Apr 10, 2008 8:13 PM EDT |
HP is a very proprietary hardware vendor, I have seen hard drives with proprietary connections, it means you can only buy your replacement/upgrade hardware from them and they will gouge your eyes out. |
| nicsmr Apr 10, 2008 8:36 PM EDT |
Tuxtom, Thanks for the wifi warning but I have a DLINK PCIMCIA wireless card that works flawlesly with linux (2 other laptops). I don't believe in fighting, I just buy stuff that works. San Diego's quite a ways from Bellingham. I'm in Edmonton. Before I put cash (or plastic) down I will try at least 3 different live cd's in any machine to make sure that things will work. If I find that a laptop with an intel card works better that's what gets bought. I'll think twice before doing that if there is an ATI card in there though. My personal preference would be a gateway or dell. I can put a finger on why I'm leery of Compaq/HP and don't know whether to trust ACER although an acquaintance of mine has an ACER Ferrari with ubuntu loaded and running. Still 2 weeks to research and ponder (ulcer time...). The catch is that the unit has to be available at a store within easy driving range of Bellingham. Seattle would be the absolute limit. Cheers all my weekend starts NOW. Have a good one. Nick |
| nicsmr Apr 10, 2008 8:59 PM EDT |
Hi again... I seem to be stuck in a rut trying to find big box electronic stores in Washington state. What big box stores do you have down there. Is best buy the only one in or around Bellingham? Nick |
| thenixedreport Apr 10, 2008 8:59 PM EDT |
Quoting:My laptop came with a gforce 7700 and it rocks my world. Wait... what are your full specs, helios? That card sounds a bit familiar...... ;) |
| techiem2 Apr 11, 2008 8:57 AM EDT |
Quoting:but I have a DLINK PCIMCIA wireless card You realize that most laptops don't come with PCMCIA slots anymore right? They all come with ExpressCard slots instead. *is still bitter about that himself* |
| tuxtom Apr 11, 2008 12:44 PM EDT |
I second techiem2: Most new laptops...especially budget ones...don't come with PCMCIA, RS-232 or DB-25 Parallel ports anymore. Bellingham's retail scene caters to Canadians. Not sure about buying a laptop anywhere other than a Best Buy, Etc. I've had good luck at Office Depot...that's where I got my Compaq and a couple printers. You should seriously get into the 21st Century and stick with the internal 802.11...is is SO much more convenient, even if you have to jump through a couple hoops to get it running in a particular distro. Nick: There's a Fry's in Renton...close to SEATAC Airport somewhere off the 405 on the way to Bellingham if you want it to be. This is about 3 hours south of Bellingham. However, only a masochist would choose to voluntarily drive it during commuting hours. It is hell until you are north of Marysville. I'd go so far as to highly recommend paying the extra fare to fly into Bellingham (BLI). |
| nicsmr Apr 11, 2008 12:57 PM EDT |
Quoted:
but I have a DLINK PCIMCIA wireless card You realize that most laptops don't come with PCMCIA slots anymore right? Techiem2... On the NIC it says cardbus. Since it looks superficially like a pcmcia card I called it that. It works on a 1.5 year old gateway running live cd knoppix and mepis. The spec on the gateway quoted PCMCIA 1 - Type I or Type II; Card Bus.. I hope that ExpressCard is the same or is compatible with cardbus.Let me know if it isn't. I'll have to find a usb nic that works. Nick |
| Bob_Robertson Apr 11, 2008 1:51 PM EDT |
> On the NIC it says cardbus. Since it looks superficially like a pcmcia card I called it that. Nono, without slots _at_all_. It seems the laptop makers are expecting folks to use USB exclusively. I got hit by this too. I pulled out my own cardbus wifi-G because the Atheros built-in in my latest laptop has no working driver and, surprise, no place to plug it in! |
| techiem2 Apr 11, 2008 2:00 PM EDT |
ExpressCard is a completely new spec/slot and isn't compatible with PCMCIA/Cardbus cards. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ExpressCard |
| nicsmr Apr 11, 2008 5:50 PM EDT |
Great.... Anyone know of a USB NIC that work? Nick |
| tuxtom Apr 12, 2008 6:35 AM EDT |
You can usually change out the internal wireless NIC in most newer laptops and replace it with an Intel, etc., that has no driver issues. These are ubuquitous and are far less hassle and less hazardous than an external USB adapter when you are travelling. They are mini-PCI. Some have integrated bluetooth, which is even nicer for travel. Intel PRO/Wireless 2200BG mini-PCI are less than $20 online and newer "N" spec supported models aren't much more. ADDITIONAL NOTE: Looks like some of the Intel NICs won't work with AMD systems. YMMV. Google. Also make sure to note the differences between mini-PCI and mini-PCIe. |
| Bob_Robertson Apr 12, 2008 11:49 AM EDT |
Well, the USB Wifi that I decided to get arrived today, and works fine. When plugged in, USB registered new driver rt18187 on kernel 2.6.24, and came up after I used one of the KDE wifi managers (can't remember which). Such is life. Anyway, I picked it up on eBay through http://stores.ebay.com/AsianNetStore they actually listed Linux compatibility as part of the description. I appreciate that very much, and made sure to tell them so. |
| nicsmr Apr 12, 2008 6:15 PM EDT |
Bob, Just ordered one on spec a couple of minutes ago. Hope it gets here before the linuxfest. At home, I will be using the wired network. Since cardbus ports don't seem to be a necessity, I guess that opens the field a bit more. Thanks for all the comments guys, it really helped. Nick |
| Sander_Marechal Apr 13, 2008 1:32 AM EDT |
Quoting:You can usually change out the internal wireless NIC in most newer laptops and replace it with an Intel, etc., that has no driver issues. Be wary though. Some manufacturers mess with the BIOS so that it checks the wifi whip that's installed and refuses to enable it if it's not the factory installed wifi. I got bitten by this on a Dell D531. I replaced the Broadcom wifi with the intel wifi from my older D520 but it refused to enable it. In reverse, the Broadcom did get enabled when it was installed in the D520. |
| Bob_Robertson Apr 13, 2008 5:19 AM EDT |
> Some manufacturers mess with the BIOS so that it checks the wifi whip that's installed and refuses to enable it if it's not the factory installed wifi. HP did that to me. No more HP, which is too bad because they're really pretty. This Compaq (I know, same company, it was on clearance...) I didn't try to swap out the card, just bought the USB wifi. We'll see. |
| nicsmr Apr 14, 2008 8:10 AM EDT |
Bob, How long did it take till you received your usb NIC from the seller on Ebay? Nick |
| Bob_Robertson Apr 14, 2008 8:39 AM EDT |
I ordered on the 2nd, it arrived the 12th. Not bad for an envelope from Hong Kong. |
| rijelkentaurus Apr 14, 2008 10:37 AM EDT |
Quoting: HP did that to me. See my quote far above, HP is horrible for this kind of crap. |
| tuxtom Apr 14, 2008 9:08 PM EDT |
Upon further reading it seems you really do need to be careful choosing a self-installed mini-PCI solution. Factory Intel is very Linux friendly, though the latest Intel graphics drivers are less than impressive. I inherited my father's OEM Ubuntu Dell 1420 with the 1440x900 screen option and it is sweet...the Intel 802.11 is flawless, and the added Dell Bluetooth card is flawless. (BTW: He is much happier with his new Macbook and 21" monitor THAT WORKS now. Good for him, good for me.) That being said, the Dell was an $850+ slab, while my Compaq F730US was $449, all said and done. I have no problem using ndiswrapper to get the job done. Aside from the Broadcom WLAN, the remaining NVIDIA chipset features work flawlessly with native drivers. I'll use the extra $400 to visit my nieces, who are much more important than software licenses. And the REAL nice part is that I don't have any USB adapters to bend or break off, which happens just about anytime I plug anything into a laptop. I have a nice little collection of bent-up thumb drives. To each their own. |
| nicsmr Apr 21, 2008 6:34 AM EDT |
Well folks its cruch time… It’s less than a week ‘till Linuxfest NorthWest and my efforts to locate a laptop to buy while there is getting serious. The Dell laptop that had all I needed is now priced a bit beyond my budget. The similar Compaq (model F756NR specs listed below) remains within my price range but lacks one thing that I need, a firewire port to import video. But it does have the Nvidia video graphics that almost all that responded to my post recommended. Have a look at the specs and let me know if this laptop would be adequate for Linux (Mepis, PCLinuxOS,or (gag) *buntu). Please Ignore the Windows Vista at the end as this will be a very short lived virus. • Processor Brand AMD • Processor AMD Turion(TM) 64 X2 • Processor Speed 1.9GHz • Display Type WXGA high-definition widescreen LCD with BrightView technology (1280 x 800) • Screen Size 15.4" • System Bus 1600MHz • Cache Memory 512KB + 512KB on die Level 2 • System Memory (RAM) 2GB • System Memory (RAM) Expandable To 3GB • Type of Memory (RAM) DDR2 • Hard Drive Type SATA (5400 rpm) • Hard Drive Size 160GB • Optical Drive Double-layer DVD±RW/CD-RW • Optical Drive Speeds Drive speeds not specified • Direct-Disc Labeling No • Digital Media Reader or Slots Yes, digital media card reader • Graphics NVIDIA GeForce 7000M • Video Memory Up to 335MB shared • Personal Video Recorder (PVR) No • TV Tuner No • MPEG Yes • Built-in Web Cam No • Modem 56 Kbps* *Capable of receiving 56 Kbps downloads. However, current regulations limit download speed to 53 Kbps. • Networking Built-in 10/100Base-T Ethernet LAN (RJ-45 connector) • Wireless Networking Built-in high-speed wireless LAN (802.11b/g) • S-Video Outputs 1 • Audio Altec Lansing • USB 2.0 Ports 3 • IEEE 1394 FireWire Ports None • Parallel Ports None • Serial Ports None • Game Ports None • Notebook Weight Thin and light (4.5 to 6 lbs.) • Battery Type Lithium-ion • Pointing Device Touchpad with dedicated vertical scroll up/down pad • Operating System Windows Vista Home Premium • Included Software HP Photosmart Essentials; muvee autoProducer; Cyberlink DVD Suite and more There are some Toshiba laptops for the same price almost the same specs (slight variation on processor but essetially the same, fast) but WITH a Firewire port BUT with Ati Radeon video that are awfully tempting. Is the ATI ‘thing’ a very serious flaw or will I be able to work with it? As always your input is greatly appreciated. Nick |
| Bob_Robertson Apr 21, 2008 7:10 AM EDT |
If you want ieee1394, then get the Toshiba. The Compaq I bought recently has no 1394 either, and if it were my only machine I would not have gotten it either because of that. Who knows, maybe someone is going to make a USB-ieee1394 adapter for just such reasons... Woops, too late. http://www.everythingusb.com/news/index/3889.htm |
| nicsmr Apr 21, 2008 7:27 AM EDT |
Bob, I do have a desktop PC that has a firewire port BUT the purpose of buying this new laptop (other than to get rid of 2 old PCs' in the house) is to be able to do it all in linux. Video processing from import to finished product, programming etc.. as I mentioned earlier as well as being my demo machine for Linux. I visited the adapter site you included and it is very interesting. I'll have ot further delve into it after work. I'm afraid that after I buy the laptop I'll be very limited as to ANY other computer purchases for at least a year. Wife/kids need food, clothing and shelter etc... Especially that last item since we've had an ongoing blizzard here for the past 4 days. I'm not talking biblical proportions but since we lost almost all our snow 2 weekends ago we're almost back to where we started. At least 20 CM. and a lot more expected. No sunshine 'till Wednesday at the earliest and nothing above 0 until Friday when I leave for Bellingham. Thanks for the comment, From the GREAT WHITE NORTH... Nick |
| techiem2 Apr 21, 2008 7:48 AM EDT |
I know there are 1394 Expresscards, but does anyone know if expresscards even work in linux yet? |
| Sander_Marechal Apr 21, 2008 10:51 AM EDT |
Quoting:Wireless Networking Built-in high-speed wireless LAN (802.11b/g) What chipset? Since it's an AMD board it's probably not going to be Intel. So it's almost certainly broadcom. And that's just a nightmare to get going. Do try to find out! |
| nicsmr Apr 21, 2008 6:13 PM EDT |
Sander... I'll try and find out. I can't find on the HP web site so I asked tech support. We'll see if they answer. Meanwhile there is a Toshiba Sattelite A215-S5837... Only problem ATI RADEON X1200 and this article...http://www.raiden.net/?cat=2&aid=405 $50 cheaper than the Compaq described above. Processor Brand AMD # Processor AMD Turion(TM) 64 X2 # Processor Speed 2.0GHz # Display Type WXGA widescreen TFT-LCD with TruBrite technology (1280 x 800) # Screen Size 15.4" # System Bus 800MHz # Cache Memory 1MB at die Level 2 # System Memory (RAM) 2GB # System Memory (RAM) Expandable To 4GB # Type of Memory (RAM) DDR2 SDRAM # Hard Drive Type Serial ATA (5400 rpm) # Hard Drive Size 160GB # Optical Drive Double-layer DVD±RW/CD-RW # Optical Drive Speeds 4x DVD+R DL; 4x DVD-R DL; 8x4x8 DVD+RW; 8x4x8 DVD-RW; 5x DVD-RAM; 24x10x24 CD-RW # Digital Media Reader or Slots Yes, digital media card reader # Diskette Drive No # Graphics ATI RADEON X1200 # Video Memory 128-319MB dynamically allocated shared # Personal Video Recorder (PVR) No # TV Tuner No # MPEG Yes # Built-in Web Cam No # Modem 56 Kbps* *Capable of receiving 56 Kbps downloads. However, current regulations limit download speed to 53 Kbps. # Networking Built-in 10/100 Ethernet LAN (RJ-45 connector) # Wireless Networking Built-in Atheros high-speed wireless network connection (802.11b/g) # S-Video Outputs 1 # Speakers Built-in stereo # PCMCIA Slots 1 ExpressCard 34/54 # USB 2.0 Ports 4 # IEEE 1394 FireWire Ports 1 # Parallel Ports None # Serial Ports None # Game Ports None # Notebook Weight Standard (more than 6 lbs.) # Battery Type Lithium-ion # Pointing Device Touchpad with enable/disable function # Operating System Windows Vista Home Premium with SP1 # Included Software Toshiba DVD Player, Disc Creator; Ulead DVD MovieFactory 5; Adobe Acrobat Reader and more Nick |
| Bob_Robertson Apr 22, 2008 4:25 AM EDT |
I wonder what "MPEG=yes" means. If your video editing doesn't require hardware acceleration, I don't see that ATI vs Nvidia is going to matter. |
| jdixon Apr 22, 2008 5:39 AM EDT |
> If your video editing doesn't require hardware acceleration, I don't see that ATI vs Nvidia is going to matter. Depends. Is the ATI chipset supported by the FOSS driver? AFAIK, the nv driver provides full 2d support for all of Nvidia's cards/chipsets. I'm not sure if that's true for ATI. Does anyone here know? |
| nicsmr Apr 22, 2008 6:14 AM EDT |
Bob, When I click the link MPEG I get this... MPEG A compressed digital video format, created by the Motion Picture Experts Group (MPEG), used to transmit and view high-quality video over the Internet. Several standardized formats have been introduced, including MPEG-1, MPEG-2 and MPEG-4. Each higher number represents a newer version with a greater level of technical sophistication. Great explanation... On the other hand Circuit city had the Acer Apire AS5720-4126 similar spec but with firewire ANd INTEL x3100 video at not too bad a price. Nick |
| nicsmr Apr 22, 2008 6:37 AM EDT |
Sander, In answer to your wireless chipset question earlier I found this in an online manual on HP's support web site. Wireless Integrated WLAN options by way of wireless module: 2 wireless antennae built into display assembly Support for no-WLAN option Support for the following WLAN formats: ● Atheros AR2425 802.11b/g ● Broadcom 802.11a/b/g ● Broadcom 802.11b/g Hope it helps. Nick |
| Bob_Robertson Apr 22, 2008 6:40 AM EDT |
I can tell you that the Madwifi and ath5k drivers won't work with their Atheros offering. Also, while the Broadcom chipset did work in 2.6.21-23 (if you grab the firmware elsewhere), changes in 2.6.24 caused it to fail again. The Broadcom and Atheros Linux teams are actively developing, so there is hope I guess. |
| nicsmr Apr 22, 2008 7:05 AM EDT |
Bob, When you received the usb network NIC (above) and used it, did it autoamagically get detected or did you have to do some setup? I know that I'll have to enter the security details when I try to connect. I'm still waiting for the one I ordered. Any day now I guess. Hope it gets here before the Linuxfest. Thanks for all the help, much appreciate it. I now have to go warm up and use the snowblower. Another 5 inches of snow on the way. Nick |
| Bob_Robertson Apr 22, 2008 7:26 AM EDT |
Since I have been using the /etc/network/interfaces file since it was invented, I edited it by hand with my WEP key and such. ----------------------- allow-hotplug wlan0 iface wlan0 inet dhcp wireless-mode managed wireless-essid you have got to be joking wireless-key1 etc etc etc. ----------------------- I found it was wlan0 by using "iwconfig" after plugging in the device. ----------------------- # iwconfig lo no wireless extensions. eth0 no wireless extensions. wlan0 IEEE 802.11g ESSID:"" etc etc etc. ------------------------ I am sure that kwirelessmanager and the other wireless setup tools will work just fine, but I haven't used them on it myself. One thing I have noticed is that the time between pluggin in the device and having the interface come up is something like two minutes. Very strange. dmesg shows the "link is not ready" message right away, but the wlan0 authentication messages don't show up for what feels like an age. I noticed that if the device is in at boot, it's much quicker. |
| nicsmr Apr 22, 2008 7:29 AM EDT |
Bob, Thanks |
| Sander_Marechal Apr 22, 2008 2:08 PM EDT |
Quoting:Sander, Looks like a breoadcom chipset then. It might work with Hardy Heron or some other brand new released distro but expect CLI work to get it running. Perhaps even using NDISWrapper. |
| nicsmr Apr 22, 2008 4:45 PM EDT |
Thanks Sander. This is the last set of specs I'll post. They are for an ACER Aspire It has everything I need as well as no ATI graphics. The Toshiba appears, from the article I linked and comments directly from the writer, to have issues. Thanks for all your comments, they are greatly appreciated. It's helped me learn a lt. Nick Model AS5720-4126 Product Type Laptops Miscellaneous Features Supported Languages English Inputs 4 x USB(USB 2.0), 1 x IEEE1394(IEEE1394), 1 x infrared (IR)(Consumer IR), 2 x Phone 1/8"(Microphone/Line-in), 1 x RJ11(Modem), 1 x RJ45(LAN) Outputs 4 x USB(USB 2.0), 1 x IEEE1394(IEEE1394), 1 x VGA(VGA), 1 x S-Video(TV-out), 1 x Phone 1/8"(Headphone/spkr/line-out w/SPDI), 1 x RJ45(LAN) Power Features Power Device 65-watt power supply, Li-ion battery Battery Features Battery Type Product Chemistry Lithium Ion Size Specialty Rechargeable Yes Battery Average Run Time 3 HOURS Display Features Type 15.4" WXGA Acer CrystalBrite TFT LCD display Display Form Factor Built-in Display Size 15 inches Color Support Up to 16.7 million colors Operating System/Software Software Included Microsoft Works 8.5, MS Office Home/Student 60-day trial, Norton Securioty (60-day trial), Acer empowering Technology & Utilities, Adobe Reader, Cyberlink Power Producer OS Provided Microsoft Windows Vista Home Premium Memory/Storage Features Hard Drive 160GB 5400RPM SATA hard drive Audio Features Audio Compliant Standards Intel HD Audio support, Dolby Digital Live Processor Features Processor Type Intel Pentium Processor Speed 1.6GHz Installed Qty 1 Max Supported Qty 1 Data Bus Speed 533 MHz Chipset Type Mobile Intel GL960 Express Networking Features Networking Integrated 10/100/1000BaseT network interface Data Link Protocol 10/100-Base T/X 802.11b/g Wireless NIC 802.11b/g Optical Storage Features Optical Storage Type 8x Super Multi DVD+/R/RW with Double Layer Support Card Reader Features Card Reader Type 5-in-1 Supported Flash Memory Cards SD, MMC, MS, MS PRO, xD Expansion / Connectivity Features Expansion Slots Total (Free) ExpressCard/54 Slot (1) Graphics Controller Features Graphics Controller Type Intel® Graphics Media Accelerator X3100 Graphics Processor / Vendor Intel Video Memory Up to 358MB shared video memory Max Resolution (external) 1280x800 Telecom Features Modem 56K ITU V.92 Protocols & Specifications V.92 Cache Memory Features Cache Memory Type L2 cache Cache Installed Size 1024 KB RAM Features Installed Size 2GB installed, 4GB maximum RAM Technology DDR2 SDRAM Memory Speed 533 MHz Memory Specification Compliance DDR2 SDRAM RAM Form Factor 2 DIMM |
| Sander_Marechal Apr 22, 2008 9:05 PM EDT |
Same note as for the previous model: Try to find out what brand the wifi chip is. Also, it has a Gigabyte NIC, which is nice if you have a gigabyte network (I do). 100 Mbps can still be quite slow if you're making backups or copying large media files over the network. |
| nicsmr Apr 23, 2008 5:53 AM EDT |
Sander, Straight from Acer's web site. Network & Communication # Network Acer InviLink 54Mbps Wi-Fi IEEE 802.11b/g # 10/100/1000Mbps Gigabit Ethernet IEEE 802.3ab I've got a USB nic coming same as the opne Bob mentioned above. Nick |
| Sander_Marechal Apr 23, 2008 7:13 AM EDT |
That doesn't tell you anything, really. InviLink is just a rebranded chip from someone else. Some googling reveals that InviLink can either be a Broadcom chipset (bad) or Atheros (good). |
| nicsmr Apr 23, 2008 7:56 AM EDT |
That's what I got... on the link you pointed to above, the acer model AS5720 is known to work Gentoo in english and mandriva in spanish (can't read it). The english page metioned that wireless worked. Thanks for the responses, I've done more research but found no other models that suit. If I can find and acer, that's what I'll get BUT I just found out that I'll be in Vegas in Early may for some SW training so I may delay a bit and see what there is to be found there. I'll keep you posted. Again Thanks Nick |
| nicsmr Apr 27, 2008 9:51 PM EDT |
Well folks its all done except the crying. Linuxfest NW is now over, I'm back home and have a new laptop. It seems I spent most of my free time searching for the one true laptop even driving an hour to marysville to look at a laptop at Radio Shack there. ALL the laptops failed the wireless test. I had given up when I rememebered I had ordered a usb NIC that is linux compatible. so I decided not to fight it and just buy one. The cheapest one I felt had too many issues according to an Equaintance (a new word???). just before leaving home I saw a new laptop at Best buy web site that had me drooling, it was everything that I was looking for in a laptop. But it was also a bit over my budget. So driving back to the hotel Saturday afternoon determined to go out an d buy a PC, our of the corner of my eye I spotted a computer store hidden in a strip mall not to far from the hotel. I swerved throught 4 lanes of traffic (okay there was no one else on the road) into the parking lot and went to see what there was to see. I wasn't expecting much but what the heck. They specialized in refurbs. I have nothing against refurbs, bought one a couple of years ago and have had not a problem with it. Anyways they had this HP pavillion that was close in specs to the one I had drooled about. With the managers permssion and under his supervision (I think he was mildly interested) I slipped in the Mepis 7 64 bit live cd and rebooted the laptop. It booted up and did the ifconfig to see what there was. LO and Behold I saw something I saw in NONE of the other pcs'. WAN0. Unbelievable, all that time wasted only to find the laptop of my dreams in a tiny computer store in a strip mall. It had the same specs as the one I had eyes for except a 120 gig hard drive and only 3 usb ports. I bought it on the spot at a greatly less price than I had budgeted for. I used it all night both wired and wireless with narry a dropped bit. It even has Nvidia graphics. I want to thank everybody that commented and responded to my plea for advice. I couldn't have done it with out you guy. This has been a good learning experience for me. I had a great time at the Linuxfest. Met lots of people. Learned lots. All I have to do now is find the distro to install. It'll be a Debian lineage Mepis maybe or Debian etch itself. I'll see. I'm tired, I'm seing double, my kids and wife are asleep and so will I be in a couple of minutes Good night all (or good morning to some). Oh Helios, I met and talked with Cathy of Zareason. Send said to say HI... If you're interested I've pasted the specs below. Again many Thanks Nick It's an HP Pavilion DV6253CL classed as an "Entertainment PC" Microprocessor 1.6 GHz AMD Turion ™ 64 X2 Dual-Core Mobile Technology TL-52 Microprocessor Cache 2 X 512KB L2 Cache Memory 2048MB DDR2 System Memory (2 Dimm) Video Graphics NVIDIA GeForce Go 6150 (UMA) Video Memory up to 128MB (shared) Hard Drive 120GB 5400RPM (SATA) Multimedia Drive Super Multi 8X DVD±R/RW with Double Layer Support Display 15.4" WXGA High-Definition Brightview Widescreen (1280 X 800) Display Fax/Modem High speed 56k modem Network Card Integrated 10/100BASE-T Ethernet LAN (RJ-45 connector) Wireless Connectivity 802.11b/g WLAN Multimedia Features HP Imprint Finish & HP Webcam with Integrated Microphone Sound Altec Lansing Keyboard 101-key compatible 2 Quick Launch Buttons (HP Quick Play Music and DVD buttons) Pointing Device Touch Pad with On/Off button and dedicated vertical scroll Up/Down pad PC Card Slots * 1 ExpressCard/54 Slot (also supports ExpressCard/34) External Ports * 5-in-1 integrated Digital Media Reader for Secure Digital cards, MultiMedia cards, Memory Stick, Memory Stick Pro, or xD Picture cards * 3 Universal Serial Bus (USB) 2.0 * 2 Headphone out - 1 w/SPDIF Digital Audio & 1 stereo * 1 microphone-in * 1 VGA (15-pin) * 1 TV-Out (S-video) * 1 RJ-11 (modem) * 1 RJ -45 (LAN) * 1 notebook expansion port 3 * 1 IEEE 1394 Firewire (4-pin) * 1 Consumer IR zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz..... |
| gus3 Apr 27, 2008 10:49 PM EDT |
Congratulations on your find, nicsmr. I know what a treat it is to find something so serendipitously. The last time I bought a laptop, I took a Knoppix 4.2 CD in for the test run. It saved me plenty of headaches and worry. |
| nicsmr Apr 28, 2008 5:52 AM EDT |
Gus3, At one point I had 4 laptops booting up at the same time in Best Buy. Had there been more laptops in my price/feature range they'd booting up too. The sales staff though I was crazy. I had 7 live cd's with me Nick |
| Bob_Robertson Apr 28, 2008 8:37 AM EDT |
Nicsmr, I'm glad you didn't need the USB nic in the end. Bravo! A question: Can you copy/paste the output of "lspci"? It will show the make/model of the wireless nic. I'm very interested, since the HP Pavillion that I bought for my Mom had a Broadcom card and HP was completely arrogant about no other card but what it shipped with working. Onigaishimasu? *edit* Or you can paste the relevant part of "lshw", which will also give that information. |
| nicsmr Apr 28, 2008 9:16 AM EDT |
Bob, I'll do it tonight when I get home... Pardon my ignorance but what is Onigaishimasu? nick |
| Bob_Robertson Apr 28, 2008 9:20 AM EDT |
One of the ways in Japanese to say "please". |
| nicsmr Apr 29, 2008 6:56 PM EDT |
Bob, lspci shows... Broadcom Corporation Dell Wireless 1390 WLAN Mini-PCI Card (rev01) hope this helps. I'm having trouble getting this to connect to my network here in Edmonton, It worked right off the bat in Bellingham. When I issue the command iwconfig essid vvvvvvv key 9999999999 channel 6 the key part of iwconfig output changes but the essid remains off/any Puzzling EDIT!!! Friggin wireless switch... gonna have to watch that.... Any Ideas thanks Nick |
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