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Wine, Linux and Multimedia Software
Wine makes a real difference to reducing one of the most significant barriers of entry to Linux. Moving to Linux is overwhelming for Windows users as they are faced with a largely alien set of software. Whilst this will have little importance to experienced Linux users, if Linux is going to significantly increase its market share of the desktop (currently about 2%) it needs Windows software to run effortlessly. Furthermore, as much as I dislike the Windows operating system, there is a vast catalogue of high quality Windows software available (some of which is free). |
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Comments (25)
5 earlier comments in the full thread.
> For most home users, Wine needs to run Windows games. At that, in my experience, it's hit or miss at best. :(
That's definitely true. I should also say I don't run very many apps with Wine.
That's definitely true. I should also say I don't run very many apps with Wine.
Lets not forget that WINE also introduces Windows security to Linux.
tracyanne --
It is my sincere hope that the underlying security of Linux can withstand a little WINE.
It is my sincere hope that the underlying security of Linux can withstand a little WINE.
Come on dino, like your namesake most humans could not survive just ingesting your spill volume. Moreover, we are familiar with two other facts: 1.) despite your propensity for tipsiness you lose very little 2.) you prefer stronger stuff than just Wine.
YBT
YBT
Scotch man, myself.
That and Dos Equis Amber.
Simple tastes for a simple man.
Simple tastes for a simple man.
Depends on the Scotch, I get very particular about that.
I'm pretty easy, so long as it's unblended and no younger than my teenager.
ta - this document is worth a look if you are worried about security + wine http://media.codeweavers.com/pub/crossover/case_studies/Wine...
@jacog, interesting
Azerthoth and all others: I have no axe to grind. What would be the use? I would like to run my favorite Windows apps as much as anyone else without the overhead of VMware or other VM's.
So every few months I fire up Wine and try. Immediatly fonts go wild all over the place, 'minor' flaws like drop down menus that don't work appear and so on. Now, perhaps if I tie myself and the operating system in different knots for every single Windows application, some of them *may* work, but then again, after houurs of fiddling, they don't.
Tell me I can play CIV2 under Wine, or PG2, and I am sold. Jeez! Tell me I can fire up Notepad without weird fonts or misbehaving menus and I would be willing to spend some more time with Wine. Till that time, accept that after fifteen years it is not ready for prime time and there is no hope that it will ever be.
Paai
So every few months I fire up Wine and try. Immediatly fonts go wild all over the place, 'minor' flaws like drop down menus that don't work appear and so on. Now, perhaps if I tie myself and the operating system in different knots for every single Windows application, some of them *may* work, but then again, after houurs of fiddling, they don't.
Tell me I can play CIV2 under Wine, or PG2, and I am sold. Jeez! Tell me I can fire up Notepad without weird fonts or misbehaving menus and I would be willing to spend some more time with Wine. Till that time, accept that after fifteen years it is not ready for prime time and there is no hope that it will ever be.
Paai
@paai, I can't tell you that,
I have no favourite windows programs, I don't use WINE as a rule, and when I do it's only to see if there is a way around some artificial restriction (like not bothering to support Linux) on using Linux with peripherals, like the TomTom. The applications have worked fine, the fonts even look fine, and the menus all work properly. The only problem I've had are accessing the peripheral itself. On the few occasions I've seen WINE being used it's usually with something like Crossover to control the settings, and the applications seemed to work properly and the same as on Windows.
Sorry can't help you.
I have no favourite windows programs, I don't use WINE as a rule, and when I do it's only to see if there is a way around some artificial restriction (like not bothering to support Linux) on using Linux with peripherals, like the TomTom. The applications have worked fine, the fonts even look fine, and the menus all work properly. The only problem I've had are accessing the peripheral itself. On the few occasions I've seen WINE being used it's usually with something like Crossover to control the settings, and the applications seemed to work properly and the same as on Windows.
Sorry can't help you.
> Tell me I can play CIV2 under Wine, or PG2, and I am sold.
That gets back to the issue of games mentioned above. I agree that it doesn't work well for gamers, but keep in mind when you suggest scrapping the project that computers can be used for other things, like work. There is most definitely room for improvement in your particular area of interest.
That gets back to the issue of games mentioned above. I agree that it doesn't work well for gamers, but keep in mind when you suggest scrapping the project that computers can be used for other things, like work. There is most definitely room for improvement in your particular area of interest.
Quoting:computers can be used for other things, like work.Bite.
Your.
Tongue.
Let me tell you what I did.
Two months ago, I installed a computer for twin boys...age 11. They are both math prodigies and we got word of them through CPS. At 13, if their development continues at this pace, they will enter college at 15. They live with a foster family...only surviving members of a family killed in an auto accident when they were 4.
A week after I had installed the computer, I got a call from their "older brother", their 17 year old step-brother I guess you would call him. He asked me where all the games were and I told him the only games I put on the computer were World of Goo and some breakout games. The rest of the computer was dedicated to Scientific Linux and the rest of the normal apps.
He howled like I had jabbed him with a hot poker. He wanted me to come over and install Windows on the computer because he said the computer was useless "to him". I explained that the computer was not meant for him and ended the phone call.
Later that evening I "dropped by" to see how things were going. We make two week, one month, three month, six month and 1 annual visit to our recipeints. When I entered the home, Michael, one of the twins (I can't tell them apart) was on the computer and Marshall was reading a book. Greg, the 17 year old was on a laptop on the couch as Mrs. FosterMom and I talked. I looked over at the kid on the couch playing some shooter game. And asked him if he wanted the url to one of the best gamesites in the business.
He jumped up and said "YEAH!"
I emailed him later that evening and made good my promise.
I sent him to astalavista.box.sk.
Without virus protection or some kind of malware agent, about 60 percent of Internet explorer browsers lock dead up...takes an act of congress or sometimes an entire drive wipe to fix it.
Spoke with Michael about two weeks later and he made mention after I asked,. that Greg hadn't been able to use his laptop for a long time...something about viruses and popups.....
Game on.
I tell people that if they want to game, get a console...computers are meant to work and produce...Games are a luxury...or so believes I. Then again, I do have Penumbra and World Of Goo installed...hypocrite that I am
h
Two months ago, I installed a computer for twin boys...age 11. They are both math prodigies and we got word of them through CPS. At 13, if their development continues at this pace, they will enter college at 15. They live with a foster family...only surviving members of a family killed in an auto accident when they were 4.
A week after I had installed the computer, I got a call from their "older brother", their 17 year old step-brother I guess you would call him. He asked me where all the games were and I told him the only games I put on the computer were World of Goo and some breakout games. The rest of the computer was dedicated to Scientific Linux and the rest of the normal apps.
He howled like I had jabbed him with a hot poker. He wanted me to come over and install Windows on the computer because he said the computer was useless "to him". I explained that the computer was not meant for him and ended the phone call.
Later that evening I "dropped by" to see how things were going. We make two week, one month, three month, six month and 1 annual visit to our recipeints. When I entered the home, Michael, one of the twins (I can't tell them apart) was on the computer and Marshall was reading a book. Greg, the 17 year old was on a laptop on the couch as Mrs. FosterMom and I talked. I looked over at the kid on the couch playing some shooter game. And asked him if he wanted the url to one of the best gamesites in the business.
He jumped up and said "YEAH!"
I emailed him later that evening and made good my promise.
I sent him to astalavista.box.sk.
Without virus protection or some kind of malware agent, about 60 percent of Internet explorer browsers lock dead up...takes an act of congress or sometimes an entire drive wipe to fix it.
Spoke with Michael about two weeks later and he made mention after I asked,. that Greg hadn't been able to use his laptop for a long time...something about viruses and popups.....
Game on.
I tell people that if they want to game, get a console...computers are meant to work and produce...Games are a luxury...or so believes I. Then again, I do have Penumbra and World Of Goo installed...hypocrite that I am
h
@jdixon,
I'd agree with tracyanne and bigg here.
Use wine only when you have to (work apps, Crossover, getting around those artificial restrictions, etc).
None of this gotta-have-this-game experimental stuff, which only leads to disappointments when the game in question doesn't work EXACTLY as expected in wine!
I would certainly agree that it's best to prioritize the wine apps that have "room for improvement in your particular area of interest." Yep. Windows games where Micro$ucks blocks effective use of wine are much lower on my own priority list. Just 2c here.
I would certainly agree that it's best to prioritize the wine apps that have "room for improvement in your particular area of interest." Yep. Windows games where Micro$ucks blocks effective use of wine are much lower on my own priority list. Just 2c here.
Quoting:Tell me I can play CIV2 under Wine
No need. FreeCiv is your answer.
> Use wine only when you have to (work apps, Crossover, getting around those artificial restrictions, etc)....
Oh, I agree. It's just that my wife has a large number of old Windows games she'd love to be able to play under Linux, wo we test them out on occasion. So far, it's been hit or miss. Nowhere near enough have worked for her to nuke her Windows machine. :(
Almost all of the games I play are old DOS games, which play fine in dosbox, though my machine is still a bit underpowered to run them at full speed. I only need a Windows machine for work compatibility, and that can be handled by a virtual machine. Again though, my machine is a bit underpowered for that.
Oh, I agree. It's just that my wife has a large number of old Windows games she'd love to be able to play under Linux, wo we test them out on occasion. So far, it's been hit or miss. Nowhere near enough have worked for her to nuke her Windows machine. :(
Almost all of the games I play are old DOS games, which play fine in dosbox, though my machine is still a bit underpowered to run them at full speed. I only need a Windows machine for work compatibility, and that can be handled by a virtual machine. Again though, my machine is a bit underpowered for that.
jdixon: I too have games as a requirement... and I am NOT buying a console; games are too expensive for them. I play most of the PC games in XP. Most of the games I have works under Linux through either Crossover Games, Cedega, or plain Wine, but since my computer's spec is good-not-great, the performance hit is a bit too high for some of them to work as well as they should.
The exception is World of Warcraft, which runs with no noticable performance hit under Linux. The only caveat is that the newly added real-time shadows effect does not work under Wine.
It's a catch-22 though. Publishers will not publish native Linux games unless people buy Linux games, and people can't buy any Linux games if there aren't any. Independant ports exist, like ones done by Linux Game Publishing, but the prices are much too high for them to hope for any long term success. A fair chunk of the games they have on offer can be bought for less than half the price for Windows.
I fell that if publishers were aware of Wine and treated Wine as a platform, they could produce Wine-friendly Windows games. There must be someone out there campaigning to them with figures.
Not that I imagine that'll do any good. Places like EA can't even be convinced to drop their brain-dead SecuRom DRM bollocks that limits you to five installs in your lifetime.
I thiiiiink there's a bit of hope though with the folks behind Steam.
The exception is World of Warcraft, which runs with no noticable performance hit under Linux. The only caveat is that the newly added real-time shadows effect does not work under Wine.
It's a catch-22 though. Publishers will not publish native Linux games unless people buy Linux games, and people can't buy any Linux games if there aren't any. Independant ports exist, like ones done by Linux Game Publishing, but the prices are much too high for them to hope for any long term success. A fair chunk of the games they have on offer can be bought for less than half the price for Windows.
I fell that if publishers were aware of Wine and treated Wine as a platform, they could produce Wine-friendly Windows games. There must be someone out there campaigning to them with figures.
Not that I imagine that'll do any good. Places like EA can't even be convinced to drop their brain-dead SecuRom DRM bollocks that limits you to five installs in your lifetime.
I thiiiiink there's a bit of hope though with the folks behind Steam.
Is it just me? Or do more people think 'translating and reverse-engineering' at the pace of which hundreds of paid Microsoft-devs introduce new OS'es / technologies isn't possible by a team of volunteers?
Anyway, for most 'older' Windows-programs (Euroglot 3 / Freecell6 - not the default Windows one but the one with the solver - most notably) Wine is OK. For Microsoft / Windows-tailored programs which make have use of .NET, VB, Excel and IE6 - such as AD Inventor - Wine is no solution.
BTW: about Astalavista.box.sk: I have always been able to clean up when I was still using XP and pirated software. It takes some skill (read: The right proggies) to do so, but it's not that hard. Visiting the site using FF (or even better: Konqueror) running on Linux solves all those problems. But you shouldn't use pirated software, ahem.
Anyway, for most 'older' Windows-programs (Euroglot 3 / Freecell6 - not the default Windows one but the one with the solver - most notably) Wine is OK. For Microsoft / Windows-tailored programs which make have use of .NET, VB, Excel and IE6 - such as AD Inventor - Wine is no solution.
BTW: about Astalavista.box.sk: I have always been able to clean up when I was still using XP and pirated software. It takes some skill (read: The right proggies) to do so, but it's not that hard. Visiting the site using FF (or even better: Konqueror) running on Linux solves all those problems. But you shouldn't use pirated software, ahem.
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For most home users, Wine needs to run Windows games. At that, in my experience, it's hit or miss at best. :(
From what I've heard and seen, for business use Wine (especially the Crossover versions), works much, much better.