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Intel Is Dead on the Desktop, Says ARM Co-Founder
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Comments (47)
27 earlier comments in the full thread.
Quoting:Apple most of the time offers way worse specs for way more money than you can get from most other makers of hardware.
Happy to hear there's still a difference between Apple / Intel!
If lots of people are short on money, old computers still fill the needs of most people, and if not, cheap computers will, I doubt if the market for $1000+ computers will continue to exist. Of course, in Russia, Dubai & Abu Dabi it will for some time to come, that's for sure.
Though - coming to think of it - Russia is pushing open source & free software in schools, so I'm not sure if children used to Linux etc. will ever be happy with a Mac. Even if their great-uncle who 'inherited' Gazprom (or such a company) buys them the most expensive for christmas (7 January I guess?).
Intel understood it though, and they started co-operating on low margin SoC's and also started to develop 'lower cost operating systems', like Linux for rural China and Meego. AMD is joining with their APU's (which are SoC's with very limited capabilities IMNSHO), and via Telechips I believe VIA is joining also. However, this is bad news to iCore7, Xeon and the rest of the high-marginproduct lines of Intel.
So, probably I should have stated the 'high margin branch' of Intel is dead, not Intel itself.
Phew, took me a lot of time to figure! On the other hand, if you 'disregard' the "high margin products" of Microsoft (to take a not so random example), all that's left is a rather chaotic mess of products which wouldn't exist without the high-margin products; Microsoft very much _is_ the high margin products.
Back to low margin sales though. The only thing I'm curious about, is if Apple will follow suit one day. I'm not sure who the shareholders of Apple currently are, but if I were one, I would be afraid of the low margin Android products already eating away Apple's lunch; even today!
Hans -
Don't know. Macs are pretty sweet machines.
I know that I pulled a few hairs out last year when I had to administer a Mac server for a while -- they have, for example, their own Apple-bred startup approach -- but they are, fundamentally, decent Unix boxes with a very nice and slick front end and good software for artistic types.
And they look good.
There will always be people ready to pay a premium for a premium product.
A Hyundai Genesis is a great car, but people still buy BMWs and Mercedeses.
Don't know. Macs are pretty sweet machines.
I know that I pulled a few hairs out last year when I had to administer a Mac server for a while -- they have, for example, their own Apple-bred startup approach -- but they are, fundamentally, decent Unix boxes with a very nice and slick front end and good software for artistic types.
And they look good.
There will always be people ready to pay a premium for a premium product.
A Hyundai Genesis is a great car, but people still buy BMWs and Mercedeses.
Quoting:I remember the venerable IBM AS/400. Terrible deal in terms of processing power, but a cockroach of a system. IBM tried killing those puppies off for years, but customers kept buying them because they worked and they never died.Ladies and gentlemen, I think we can now, officially, retire the "if computers were like cars" simile.
You're not pulling out the old "if cars were like computers, they'd cost $100 & go 900 mph" simile, are you??? Please no...
If more of us were hard-core gamers and had liquid-cooled rigs, cars would be more like computers (especially because I blew out a thermostat housing and thermostat and leaked coolant for weeks until I parted with $400).
I prefer Poppycock, that tasty conglomeration of popcorn, nuts, and sweet coating.
Quoting:We've got a bunch of dual-CPU G5s in this shop, and while they look great, they're dogs. Just about any Intel-based machine can walk all over themA few years ago my brother (who worked in a mac shop) brought me some broken G4's. I managed to fix the broken power suplies (apple like to use its own plugs and such), and started to use the desktop as my main desktop. I loved it, it was fast and quick, did everything I needed, didn't get viruses. It had a 786mhz G4 processor, and still worked like a charm. The computers I used before that were Windows PC's with pentiums with speeds over 2,6 Ghz. And the G4 mac was better in all sorts of things. So, I wouldn't say that G4's (or G5') were (are) that bad.
But after this I discovered that Linux was also great on the desktop (I was modifying emebed devices that ran Linux, and never even thought that Linux was capable of being a good desktop OS), and then I stoped using the Mac.
I was right, for a change!
See "Microsoft Is Said to Announce Version of Windows for ARM Chips at CES Show"
http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2010-12-21/microsoft-is-said-t...
This is not Microsoft saying Intel is dead, but at least saying their marriage is over (though they'll remain bet friends) and currently ARM is more attractive.
See "Microsoft Is Said to Announce Version of Windows for ARM Chips at CES Show"
http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2010-12-21/microsoft-is-said-t...
This is not Microsoft saying Intel is dead, but at least saying their marriage is over (though they'll remain bet friends) and currently ARM is more attractive.
Wait, I thought Windows was never, never, never EVER going to run on anything but Intel from here on out?
That's what they'd like Intel to think! Much in the same way Intel wants Microsoft to think they won't be pushing anything besides Windows.
I think selling XScale to Marvell was a pretty dumb move of Intel, especially as Marvell evolved these chips to the server and now Microsoft may support said Marvell chips in the near future.
Of course, those who followed the news saw this coming, and probably so did Intel. But, they have no proof as MS can 'plausible deny' pushing ARM, they can say it's only a last resort or some other weak excuse.
Having seen MS the last few years, if they'll arrive at the party at all, they will be late; normally 'even after the party mood peaked'.
I think selling XScale to Marvell was a pretty dumb move of Intel, especially as Marvell evolved these chips to the server and now Microsoft may support said Marvell chips in the near future.
Of course, those who followed the news saw this coming, and probably so did Intel. But, they have no proof as MS can 'plausible deny' pushing ARM, they can say it's only a last resort or some other weak excuse.
Having seen MS the last few years, if they'll arrive at the party at all, they will be late; normally 'even after the party mood peaked'.
The nice thing on Linux programs is that they (most of them) are opensource, while most of the programs on windows, are closed source.
That will make it allot harder to have certain windows programs on arm. At least there is something positive in this: all viruses need to be recompiled for arm.
Quoting:At least there is something positive in this: all viruses need to be recompiled for arm.
But unless they change the OS, after a quick recompile, they WILL run.
That's the funny part.
@JaseP --
But on ARM, they'll consume less electricity when they do. Still a win, right?
But on ARM, they'll consume less electricity when they do. Still a win, right?
Windows on ARM: Costing your time 85% more efficiently than before!
Windows on ARM... It'll probably push ARM into the "Megahertz" race.
I just can't see MS making a mean, lean and clean Windows 7 derivative, with a modern underpinning and concise API (.NET only?). It'll probably be a halfhearted attempt to get HAL up to snuff and some tweaks to mitigate the worst of the legacy cruft. Then ARM has to contend with a crappy, bloated Windows and the masses of consumer zombies demanding it on their ARM devices.
How many ARM "dedicated addons" to speed things up before an ARM setup is as complex as any old x86(_64) setup?
I just can't see MS making a mean, lean and clean Windows 7 derivative, with a modern underpinning and concise API (.NET only?). It'll probably be a halfhearted attempt to get HAL up to snuff and some tweaks to mitigate the worst of the legacy cruft. Then ARM has to contend with a crappy, bloated Windows and the masses of consumer zombies demanding it on their ARM devices.
How many ARM "dedicated addons" to speed things up before an ARM setup is as complex as any old x86(_64) setup?
"Concise API"? LMAO. Not part of Microsoft's vocabulary.
MS bought an ARMv7 architectural license, so I'm pretty convinced they are currently working on some kind of emulator or code translator.
My bet:
They recompile Win7 for ARM, removing just enough bloat to squeeze it on to the average Android Tablet's specs... Probably buggy as hell for the first 3 releases.
They recompile Win7 for ARM, removing just enough bloat to squeeze it on to the average Android Tablet's specs... Probably buggy as hell for the first 3 releases.
Will DRM slow down as bad or worse on ARM than on Intel?
I, for one, don't care to find out.
I, for one, don't care to find out.
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No question that Macs are not bang-for-the-buck machines in some cycles and space sense, but --
I remember the venerable IBM AS/400. Terrible deal in terms of processing power, but a cockroach of a system. IBM tried killing those puppies off for years, but customers kept buying them because they worked and they never died.