Groklaw Articles Ending on May 16th
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Comments (40)
20 earlier comments in the full thread.
@gus3 heinlein adds, `but dont rule out malice` and predates hanlon's razor by nearly 40 years.
Maybe someone can poke ESR to write a Halloween doc XII now Groklaw is gone? Yeah, I'll miss it too, even while I voiced some criticism about the 'non-disclosure' of the one who wrote the blog.
Maybe when I'm sixty we'll all finally know who was behind the blog, and if there was a 'deep throat' behind the blog as well. Until then, a job well done; apart from Roy I can't think of someone else who put that many effort in it.
I'd rather we never know for sure, just to spite Maureen O'Gara.
Agree, because after all, what's the fun of knowing who Roy is? I'd rather know some MS-shills which are still out there by name (Oh, forgot; one of the most important - thanks to Roy - I do!).
More serious, I think when you're as 'high in the three' as PJ was, full disclosure may have been pretty suicidal. More interesting would have been if there was any 'corporate' money backing the blog or not.
More serious, I think when you're as 'high in the three' as PJ was, full disclosure may have been pretty suicidal. More interesting would have been if there was any 'corporate' money backing the blog or not.
But Grocklaw is still needed.
As a forum which brings competent review and appraisal to stories that straddle the mostly neglected intersection of technology and law, and recruits both the solid IT expertise and the solid legal expertise needed together to promote a real understanding of these stories, and addresses them from a reasonably well-informed and objective perspective, Groklaw has been invaluable, and is still needed.
I never saw Groklaw as an "anti-SCO" site, but as a law and technology site, whose focus was somewhat hijacked by the SCOG attempt to steal Linux. There are are still new and ongoing issues which need the kind of attention that Groklaw can bring to bear - and so far, only Groklaw has.
Even today, the news makes abundantly clear -- with a steady stream of new stories such as the Sony v GeoHotz case, the Novell patents (CPTN) deal, and many other similar issues -- that a site such as Groklaw, which can provide an objective and fair-minded yet FOSS-friendly perspective (or for that matter, even a FOSS-sceptical perspective!) to the legal facets of socially significant "technology stories" is an immensely valuable resource and will be difficult to replace or even match.
The mainstream press and even the technology-oriented journals overlook or give only superficial attention to these issues. If Groklaw isn't addressing them, will anybody else pay attention? Groklaw hasn't become out-dated. Far from it! But perhaps this is a felicitous moment for for PJ to stand-back, rest up, and reassess Grocklaw's focus and priorities, and remember what it's raison d'etre has really been all along.
And if PJ still decides she really is done, her contribution has been very substantial, and greatly appreciated.
As a forum which brings competent review and appraisal to stories that straddle the mostly neglected intersection of technology and law, and recruits both the solid IT expertise and the solid legal expertise needed together to promote a real understanding of these stories, and addresses them from a reasonably well-informed and objective perspective, Groklaw has been invaluable, and is still needed.
I never saw Groklaw as an "anti-SCO" site, but as a law and technology site, whose focus was somewhat hijacked by the SCOG attempt to steal Linux. There are are still new and ongoing issues which need the kind of attention that Groklaw can bring to bear - and so far, only Groklaw has.
Even today, the news makes abundantly clear -- with a steady stream of new stories such as the Sony v GeoHotz case, the Novell patents (CPTN) deal, and many other similar issues -- that a site such as Groklaw, which can provide an objective and fair-minded yet FOSS-friendly perspective (or for that matter, even a FOSS-sceptical perspective!) to the legal facets of socially significant "technology stories" is an immensely valuable resource and will be difficult to replace or even match.
The mainstream press and even the technology-oriented journals overlook or give only superficial attention to these issues. If Groklaw isn't addressing them, will anybody else pay attention? Groklaw hasn't become out-dated. Far from it! But perhaps this is a felicitous moment for for PJ to stand-back, rest up, and reassess Grocklaw's focus and priorities, and remember what it's raison d'etre has really been all along.
And if PJ still decides she really is done, her contribution has been very substantial, and greatly appreciated.
You said what I thought BernardSwiss!
I think Florian Mueller does fill a 'part of the gap' though;
http://fosspatents.blogspot.com/2011/04/analysis-of-new-nove...
has also written about the Oracle / Google copyright problems on his blog, and many more legal issues. No para-legal though, maybe not the same exhaustive research, but also a job well done.
I think Florian Mueller does fill a 'part of the gap' though;
http://fosspatents.blogspot.com/2011/04/analysis-of-new-nove...
has also written about the Oracle / Google copyright problems on his blog, and many more legal issues. No para-legal though, maybe not the same exhaustive research, but also a job well done.
Florian Mueller!?!? You have got to be kidding... When he gets something right, it's rare.
Roy, Mueller ... Hans is your tinfoil supply so dangerously low?
Quoting:When he gets something right, it's rare.That's a given, since it's never well-done.
@gus3 -
Watch out or we'll ship you off to the punitentiary.
Watch out or we'll ship you off to the punitentiary.
I drop in for a refreshing visit to good ole LXer after working hard for days and days, and what is my reward? Puns. Noxious puns. Puns are only for groan ups.
@TC:
Disgusting, isn't it? I don't know what gets into these people.
Disgusting, isn't it? I don't know what gets into these people.
...but we can see what comes out of these people. Ick.
Quoting:When he gets something right, it's rare.
Elaborate!
Elaborate?!?!
Ok, just a short list (because I don't have the time and really don't feel like getting into it) :
* The accusation that Google's use of "scrubbed" Linux header files is a copyright violation of the GPL... Refuted by Linus Torvalds himself.
* Florian spearheads the No Software Patents movement in the EU, goes after IBM as a software patent "baddy," but strangely ignores the abuses of M$.
* Florian often over inflates the validity of patents used in patent violation suits. Often, these cover basic & obvious computing functions.
The bottom line is that the guy chimes in on a very legal related subject, but as far as I know, has no legal training what so ever. And his opinion, on what patents are valid or not, are not only shared by a small group (him & the plaintiffs), but more often than not, smack of an attempt to throw gasoline on the fire. The guy is a lobbyist, not an IP expert.
Ok, just a short list (because I don't have the time and really don't feel like getting into it) :
* The accusation that Google's use of "scrubbed" Linux header files is a copyright violation of the GPL... Refuted by Linus Torvalds himself.
* Florian spearheads the No Software Patents movement in the EU, goes after IBM as a software patent "baddy," but strangely ignores the abuses of M$.
* Florian often over inflates the validity of patents used in patent violation suits. Often, these cover basic & obvious computing functions.
The bottom line is that the guy chimes in on a very legal related subject, but as far as I know, has no legal training what so ever. And his opinion, on what patents are valid or not, are not only shared by a small group (him & the plaintiffs), but more often than not, smack of an attempt to throw gasoline on the fire. The guy is a lobbyist, not an IP expert.
Thanks, that's all I wanted to hear!
OTOH, I'm not sure "IP-experts" do know about patent validity, I think when cross-patent deals between companies are made - at that time it's mostly unknown to them if the patents they're trading will be upheld in court. It even matters which and what level of court; as the Microsoft/MP3 patents showed.
OTOH, I'm not sure "IP-experts" do know about patent validity, I think when cross-patent deals between companies are made - at that time it's mostly unknown to them if the patents they're trading will be upheld in court. It even matters which and what level of court; as the Microsoft/MP3 patents showed.
Quoting: OTOH, I'm not sure "IP-experts" do know about patent validity
I disagree with this part of your statement. I think they very much DO KNOW about patent validity, but just don't care. They are not paid to care, and instead, chase the money. I think it's hard not to know that patents for things like, "a computer connected wirelessly to the Internet & mounted on or in the dashboard of a car," is blatantly obvious to everyone, let alone someone skilled in the art, and forgetting prior art...
But I agree with uncertainty part of your statement, and believe they are banking on the uncertainty & cost of litigation to force cross-patent deals. If all these suits were just posturing for cross-patent deals, I'd say the "IP experts" carved a nice little snake oil industry for themselves. But things, like "The Halloween documents," don't support that.
And, I am sure that M$ is not alone in using patent suits in a "submarine patent" way, resorting to cross licensing deals as a "Plan B," when they are unsure of their footing. But, then again, the use of such obvious patents in the law suits begs the question of whether they know how the defending side will take it, maybe as a "wink and nod." So, what they COULD be doing is characterizing damages as injury, to soften the tax blow of licensing/vending deals, and using the Court as a pawn to do it. Think Lisa Marie Presley & Michael Jackson divorce settlement (and the rights to Elvis's songs part of the deal)... And using shills like Florian to make it all look Kosher in the press...
Just a thought...
@JaseP -
They do know and they do care, but...
Attorneys are obligated to represent their clients' interests, and if those interests include taking advantage of a badly run patent office, then they are obligated to do so.
Nature of the job.
They do know and they do care, but...
Attorneys are obligated to represent their clients' interests, and if those interests include taking advantage of a badly run patent office, then they are obligated to do so.
Nature of the job.
Dino,
I AM an attorney, so I know... I also don't practice law any longer. So, I don't have to condone moral equivocation any more...
I AM an attorney, so I know... I also don't practice law any longer. So, I don't have to condone moral equivocation any more...
@JaseP -
Been there, done that as well.
Been there, done that as well.
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