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A dystopian future - looking beyond Windows Vista
If the thought of Microsoft Vista's DRM restrictions, restrictive EULA, version confusion and user lock-in has you scared then you definitely do not want to know what the lads from Redmond have in store for the next version. If this patent application, covered by Groklaw here, is anything to go by then the next version of Windows, Vista+1 is really going to give you nightmares. Here's the abstract from the patent application: An operating system and method for use include a core function module, or basic kernel, providing fundamental operating system support and one or more add-on modules that allow customization of the operating system as desired. Add-on modules may provide support or extended capability to the computer including hardware, applications, peripherals, and support. A digital signature may be used to confirm the integrity of an add-on module prior to installation. Certification may be verified to determine if installation of the add-on module is authorized. By withholding certification, a service provider may manage illegal or undesired modifications to a provided computer. Digital rights management may be used to enforce terms of use of the add-on module in keeping with licensing arrangements. In simpler terms it's a modular OS, much like Linux, whereby every package will have to be bought separately, has been heavily DRM'ed and will be licensed under different licensing terms. And I'm not talking about applications here but about things that people see as core OS functionality, such as basic networking, internet access, running multiple instances of one application, using an USB device (licensed on a per-device basis), etcetera. You'll even have to pay separately just to be able to install third-party applications or to use the new RAM you bought:
You should read the actual patent application for more and scarier examples. It's only a few pages long anyway. It looks like Microsoft wants users to pay separately for every basic OS functionality that they use through some sort of web shop, much the same way that antiquated mainframes used to be licensed out but with the added pixie-dust of “…through the internet”. It will actively throttle down functionality that it is capable of, but which has not been payed for. Or it will “restrict unauthorized operating system extensions from being installed that may support unauthorized hardware and/or software”. So not only do you have to pay for new hardware, you have to pay again in order to use it to it's full capacity. And you can bet that the hardware makes will have to pay Microsoft as well to be included in their web shop. This is Microsoft ultimate wet dream of lock-in through DRM. It has been their wet dream ever since they came up with Longhorn and Trusted Computing. Longhorn is the monstrosity that spawned Vista after years of delay, various rewites, dropping most of it's features and bolting it to an existing platform (Windows Server 2003) because writing a new platform proved impossible. Matthew Broersma was right when he stated that Windows Vista is the last monolithic OS. Welcome to modular Longhorn. The message is clear. Get out while you can. Microsoft's only interest is to empty your pockets and keep your computer hostage. It wants to turn computing into a monopoly content distribution channel and sell you to the highest bidder. Choose freedom and switch to Free/Open-source software. This article has also been posted to the author's website. |
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Comments (80)
Newsflash - 2007: The year MS re-invents hardware lock-in.
I'd guess about twice what ever they charge for their 'Completely Ultimate Extreme Fantastic Windows Robber Baron' Edition.
Quoting:This kind of thing can't possibly fly, can it?
Ofcourse not, but that doesn't mean they're not going to try. Read the patent application. The kernel + the DRM module + an interface to the webshop will be given away for free. Well, at least we stop paying the MS tax :-)
Knowing MS's track records it'll be in development for 7 years after which they realised they just produced an equivalent to BSD 4.2 written in ActiveX, then simply bolt on a new UI to Vista Server and wrap the "Add/Remove applications" and every option/configuration dialog in Windows in a DRM layer. Want to disable Clippie? That's $50 please!
The funniest thing is that in 7-10 years when this will probably come out, DRM will likely be history and we all enjoy fixed-fee blanket licensing worldwide.
Forget about hardware lockin. There are attempts to corrupt and 'Vistacise' the Web, using formats and so-called 'standards' to force non-Windows users out of the loop. It's not just about locking _existing_ Windows users.
It's "lock-in" and "lock-out". They lock existing users with no brains to think for themselves in and the rest out as irrelevant.
This is of course assuming that the majority of computer users in the world are really *that* dumb.
But if they are not, then MS will be shooting a yet another bullet in its foot, this time a deadly poisoned one!
This whole movement towards deliberately defective anti-technology is so bizarre that it looks like we're living in some sort of a simulated fantasy world. It's incredible. These people are just out of their freaking minds.
This is of course assuming that the majority of computer users in the world are really *that* dumb.
But if they are not, then MS will be shooting a yet another bullet in its foot, this time a deadly poisoned one!
This whole movement towards deliberately defective anti-technology is so bizarre that it looks like we're living in some sort of a simulated fantasy world. It's incredible. These people are just out of their freaking minds.
Gone out of their minds while trying to get into your bank account...
"This kind of thing can't possibly fly, can it? Even grandma, who knows nothing about computers, isn't naive enough to fall for this crap, is she? The iPod/iTunes generation, yes, but grandma?"
well when the government writes web pages for on os and browser and they force countries to use their software using WIPO and WTO as fronts then yes this could fly - and fly high.
well when the government writes web pages for on os and browser and they force countries to use their software using WIPO and WTO as fronts then yes this could fly - and fly high.
This will fly. These are the actions of a company that has a monopoly and uses (really abuses) it to their own ends. MS is certain that they can make this fly. And I believe that they can and will do it whether they have a patent or not because of their monopoly position.
A commenter on Groklaw has speculated that this is a trial balloon by MS to see how this modular crippled OS will be reacted to. It has been pointed out that the only difference with this and some prior, very similar systems is that it is done over the internet. Delivery by the Internet is not very unique (Linspire anyone?) and may not be enough for them to obtain a patent
A commenter on Groklaw has speculated that this is a trial balloon by MS to see how this modular crippled OS will be reacted to. It has been pointed out that the only difference with this and some prior, very similar systems is that it is done over the internet. Delivery by the Internet is not very unique (Linspire anyone?) and may not be enough for them to obtain a patent
> This will fly. These are the actions of a company that has a monopoly
It might fly. More generally, MS is changing its business model. Why did people go with Windows in the first place? Mostly because it's cheap. (In the view of those people - in other words, Windows 98 added a few dollars to the cost of a PC eight years ago).
If MS decides to act like a monopolist, and you believe in free markets, they will likely run into some roadblocks. I see a lot of people making comments that MS can do anything they want. Not really. Just as the dot com bust showed there was no "new economy" where you didn't need a business plan to get funding, the same boring old laws of supply and demand still apply to MS.
It might work, but let's use some caution here, this is far different from slapping a low-end OS on every PC that comes off the assembly line. I have faith in the intelligence of people. That's especially true if you give them sufficient reason to investigate alternatives. To act like a true monopolist, there needs to be no good substitutes. I see two good substitutes for most people in Linux and Mac.
It might fly. More generally, MS is changing its business model. Why did people go with Windows in the first place? Mostly because it's cheap. (In the view of those people - in other words, Windows 98 added a few dollars to the cost of a PC eight years ago).
If MS decides to act like a monopolist, and you believe in free markets, they will likely run into some roadblocks. I see a lot of people making comments that MS can do anything they want. Not really. Just as the dot com bust showed there was no "new economy" where you didn't need a business plan to get funding, the same boring old laws of supply and demand still apply to MS.
It might work, but let's use some caution here, this is far different from slapping a low-end OS on every PC that comes off the assembly line. I have faith in the intelligence of people. That's especially true if you give them sufficient reason to investigate alternatives. To act like a true monopolist, there needs to be no good substitutes. I see two good substitutes for most people in Linux and Mac.
> Mostly because it's cheap.
Wow, It sure isn't now... and much more of a pita to bootleg ;-).
This is just another example of MS driving the 'customers' away, and ultimately, putting itself out of business.
Wow, It sure isn't now... and much more of a pita to bootleg ;-).
This is just another example of MS driving the 'customers' away, and ultimately, putting itself out of business.
Well, if this new modular DRM'ed OS ever sees the light of day, there will be two big advantages:
1) Since the core OS is given away for free, us Linux folk don't pay an MS tax anymore.
2) End-users are finally confronted with the cost of Windows. Most now "feel" it's free because it came with the comuter. That will change when they have to pony up $25 to open more than 5 windows, $50 to run multiple applications, $40 to get more than 500 kbps on their DSL line, etcetera. It'll drive people to Linux :-)
1) Since the core OS is given away for free, us Linux folk don't pay an MS tax anymore.
2) End-users are finally confronted with the cost of Windows. Most now "feel" it's free because it came with the comuter. That will change when they have to pony up $25 to open more than 5 windows, $50 to run multiple applications, $40 to get more than 500 kbps on their DSL line, etcetera. It'll drive people to Linux :-)
Vista upgrade invalidates your XP key
Quoting:January 29th, 2007 by Blairhttp://www.tomcoyote.org/tech/vista-upgrade-invalidates-your...
If you choose to purchase an upgrade version of Windows Vista to upgrade XP, you will no longer be able to use that version of XP. Either on another system, or as a dual-boot option. The key will be invalidated, preventing activation.
From Vista’s EULA found here (PDF) :
13. UPGRADES. To use upgrade software, you must first be licensed for the software that is eligiblefor the upgrade. Upon upgrade, this agreement takes the place of the agreement for the software you upgraded from. After you upgrade, you may no longer use the software you upgraded from.
That's pretty bad in and of itself, but combine that with the fact that Vista Upgrade packages can no longer be used to do a clean install and you've got a problem. It means that you cannot re-install Vista Upgrade *ever*. You can't install a clean version and you can't install XP and do an upgrade.
This means that everyone who used Vista Upgrade will have to go out and by Vista Full when they need to reinstall the OS in about a year.
This means that everyone who used Vista Upgrade will have to go out and by Vista Full when they need to reinstall the OS in about a year.
That upgrade provision is nothing new.
All upgrade licenses that I have ever seen say something similar.
The real question is this: Does anything specifically prevent you from downgrading back to XP, ie, give up all rights to use Vista and go back to XP?
THAT would be new and awful.
The real question is this: Does anything specifically prevent you from downgrading back to XP, ie, give up all rights to use Vista and go back to XP?
THAT would be new and awful.
> THAT would be new and awful.
XP had the same clause.
XP had the same clause.
Linux
Look these idiots at Microsoft don't realize they are ticking people off. They are a bunch of computer people who deal with computers day in and day out. Since they don’t deal with real people on a day-to-day basis where it comes to interfacing with average human beings they are just plain stupid.
Now...Here is the only way we can beat them. They don’t understand that piracy is going to be around forever but rather than loose 10 or 15 % maybe a little more to piracy they are willing to tick off most of their customer base to the point they switch to something else like Linux and they hopefully loose 70 or 80% of their business because of their arrogant stupidity.
Its time people, Linux applications are now up to par with windows, you have Suse which is free and easy to load, Gentoo, Ubuntu, Mandrake all free and easy to use, all have word processors, spread sheets, games etc. For servers you can use the above products which have those capabilities built into them or you can go dedicated to programs like the home version of ClarkConnect which again is free and will give you a really good firewall, mail server, file server, anti virus, spam filtering, backup capabilities, web server and more...lots more. It’s free also; you also have programs like Freenaz for dedicated file server and other. ALL of the Linux programs are basically free to home users. Business may have to pay a little for enterprise stuff but its still a whole lot less than going with Microsoft. I seen a comparison the other day comparing a 100-employee company to setup 100 workstations with identical networks with Microsoft at $21000.00 and Linux was around $1000.00. I highly recommend you pick a suse 10, google it, download it, use it. Get Linux books and Learn Linux. Business, take a look at your savings, go Linux. If we start doing this across the board we can turn Microsoft into just another cheap gaming company. The way they are heading, those of you who don’t will be stuck having to pay for every little thing you want to do piece by piece, part by part. The next version of Vista allegedly will going to require you to pay for each and everything you want to do...add memory, it wont work unless you pay for use to add it to the software; want to ad any feature, you pay for it. Right now if you upgrade your XP to windows Vista, you XP key is no longer valid, you cant use your XP program unless you have a way to bypass authentication. If we all get together and do this we can get Microsoft's attention and MAKE them play fair with the end user or put them out of business. You say they are to big to put out of business, switch to Linux or other operating system that doesn't feed money to them and see how fast they crumble. DO IT...DO IT NOW!
Its time people, Linux applications are now up to par with windows, you have Suse which is free and easy to load, Gentoo, Ubuntu, Mandrake all free and easy to use, all have word processors, spread sheets, games etc. For servers you can use the above products which have those capabilities built into them or you can go dedicated to programs like the home version of ClarkConnect which again is free and will give you a really good firewall, mail server, file server, anti virus, spam filtering, backup capabilities, web server and more...lots more. It’s free also; you also have programs like Freenaz for dedicated file server and other. ALL of the Linux programs are basically free to home users. Business may have to pay a little for enterprise stuff but its still a whole lot less than going with Microsoft. I seen a comparison the other day comparing a 100-employee company to setup 100 workstations with identical networks with Microsoft at $21000.00 and Linux was around $1000.00. I highly recommend you pick a suse 10, google it, download it, use it. Get Linux books and Learn Linux. Business, take a look at your savings, go Linux. If we start doing this across the board we can turn Microsoft into just another cheap gaming company. The way they are heading, those of you who don’t will be stuck having to pay for every little thing you want to do piece by piece, part by part. The next version of Vista allegedly will going to require you to pay for each and everything you want to do...add memory, it wont work unless you pay for use to add it to the software; want to ad any feature, you pay for it. Right now if you upgrade your XP to windows Vista, you XP key is no longer valid, you cant use your XP program unless you have a way to bypass authentication. If we all get together and do this we can get Microsoft's attention and MAKE them play fair with the end user or put them out of business. You say they are to big to put out of business, switch to Linux or other operating system that doesn't feed money to them and see how fast they crumble. DO IT...DO IT NOW!
Quoting:I highly recommend you pick a suse 10, google it, download it, use it.I would rather recommend PCLinuxOS, Kubuntu, Mepis, or anything else. For a desktop and may be server, they are as good as if not better in some areas than Suse. Suse WAS my distro of choice for a while, but since the other distros offer the same as Suse, and in some areas much better, and considering the agreement of Novell with MS, I have a problem with recommending Suse any more. Then again, FOSS is about choice and preference, and I do recommend to kick the tires first and select what suits you best.
Live CDs make picking a first Distro pretty easy. Try a few before you install.
What are you talking about?
2 earlier comments in the full thread.
I am not really trying to be defensive. I'm trying to be logical.
But first, XP Pro was $300. If I made $10 / hour then it would take 30 hours of work (less than a week) to buy Windows. And this is Pro, mind you. Now then, it would take me WELL over a week to learn linux and be able to do the same things. So "such an expensive, customer-hostile" seems wrong to me. In fact Linux is more expensive because my time isn't worthless. And because it is easier to use it certainly doesn't seem customer-hostile.
But that's not the point. You said you don't have to pay for additional functionality. Really? How much is any of the functionallity offered by Oracle. Whoops. Not free. And drivers aren't always provided so I guess I need to research the device and write my own, which will take at least two months. The time I spend costs money.
But that's not the point either. The point is that the exact same cost for modularity existed in the difference between XP Home and XP Pro. And nobody complained.
This patent is clearly for that same thing only a more modular basis. Maybe I want to use IIS but I don't want remote desktop. So I don't need all the features of Pro and I don't need all the price of Pro. I can now buy just the part I need.
What proof do you have that it actually means "gouge the suckers?" You too seem to have an unfounded bias which guides you more than reason and logic.
Like I said before, there is no way Microsoft is going to sell just a minimalist Operating System that then requires users to purchase a seperate module for memory management as the author had suggested. What every single Windows customer expects is to be able to buy, install, and run. It seems pretty obvious that they will deliver that like they always have.
But first, XP Pro was $300. If I made $10 / hour then it would take 30 hours of work (less than a week) to buy Windows. And this is Pro, mind you. Now then, it would take me WELL over a week to learn linux and be able to do the same things. So "such an expensive, customer-hostile" seems wrong to me. In fact Linux is more expensive because my time isn't worthless. And because it is easier to use it certainly doesn't seem customer-hostile.
But that's not the point. You said you don't have to pay for additional functionality. Really? How much is any of the functionallity offered by Oracle. Whoops. Not free. And drivers aren't always provided so I guess I need to research the device and write my own, which will take at least two months. The time I spend costs money.
But that's not the point either. The point is that the exact same cost for modularity existed in the difference between XP Home and XP Pro. And nobody complained.
This patent is clearly for that same thing only a more modular basis. Maybe I want to use IIS but I don't want remote desktop. So I don't need all the features of Pro and I don't need all the price of Pro. I can now buy just the part I need.
What proof do you have that it actually means "gouge the suckers?" You too seem to have an unfounded bias which guides you more than reason and logic.
Like I said before, there is no way Microsoft is going to sell just a minimalist Operating System that then requires users to purchase a seperate module for memory management as the author had suggested. What every single Windows customer expects is to be able to buy, install, and run. It seems pretty obvious that they will deliver that like they always have.
Logical? Er, ok, but I think you missed the boat a bit there. Oracle is not free for either Linux or Windows, so what's your point?
Writing your own drivers? You're joking, right? You don't have to do that. Linux supports more hardware out-of-the-box than Windows. And you don't have to install them from CDs or reboot eleventy-nine times, or phone home to the mother ship for permission.
How many hours at $10/hr do you waste trying to secure Windows, which is simply not secure-able, and how much money do you waste on anti-malware software?
How many hours at $10/hr are Windows' forced hardware upgrades costing you?
How can you say that this absurd patent is in any way a good thing, or that having multiple crippled verions of Windows is more cost-effective than an operating system that gives you everything? That is definitely gouging the suckers.
BTW, I've always crabbed about the artificial distinctions between Windows versions, going back to NT 4 Server and Desktop. The physical difference was about 500 lines of code that put artificial limitations on how many users could connect to the server functions. The cost difference was substantial when you added up the higher server license and CALs. Gouging all the way. Not unlike putting a governor on your car, and for $5000 more they'll take it off so you can go faster.
Oh, and don't blame Linux for Microsoft's abuse of their monopoly power and taking away your choices as a customer. That alone is enough reason to not send money to redmond, let alone shoddy product quality and overpriced products.
Writing your own drivers? You're joking, right? You don't have to do that. Linux supports more hardware out-of-the-box than Windows. And you don't have to install them from CDs or reboot eleventy-nine times, or phone home to the mother ship for permission.
How many hours at $10/hr do you waste trying to secure Windows, which is simply not secure-able, and how much money do you waste on anti-malware software?
How many hours at $10/hr are Windows' forced hardware upgrades costing you?
How can you say that this absurd patent is in any way a good thing, or that having multiple crippled verions of Windows is more cost-effective than an operating system that gives you everything? That is definitely gouging the suckers.
BTW, I've always crabbed about the artificial distinctions between Windows versions, going back to NT 4 Server and Desktop. The physical difference was about 500 lines of code that put artificial limitations on how many users could connect to the server functions. The cost difference was substantial when you added up the higher server license and CALs. Gouging all the way. Not unlike putting a governor on your car, and for $5000 more they'll take it off so you can go faster.
Oh, and don't blame Linux for Microsoft's abuse of their monopoly power and taking away your choices as a customer. That alone is enough reason to not send money to redmond, let alone shoddy product quality and overpriced products.
> How many hours at $10/hr do you waste trying to secure Windows
Exactly, sort of, considering I make a lot more than that. And when you do have the inevitable security problem, how much time does it take to fix? I remember reading about how to take spyware out of the registry and asked myself "Why am I doing this again?"
> What every single Windows customer expects is to be able to buy, install, and run. It seems pretty obvious that they will deliver that like they always have.
I'd like to see that. My mom tried that once, and I found 480+ pieces of spyware on her machine after 4 months. Maintenance time is wasted time. Always. My only maintenance of my Debian system is pushing the update button every so often.
Exactly, sort of, considering I make a lot more than that. And when you do have the inevitable security problem, how much time does it take to fix? I remember reading about how to take spyware out of the registry and asked myself "Why am I doing this again?"
> What every single Windows customer expects is to be able to buy, install, and run. It seems pretty obvious that they will deliver that like they always have.
I'd like to see that. My mom tried that once, and I found 480+ pieces of spyware on her machine after 4 months. Maintenance time is wasted time. Always. My only maintenance of my Debian system is pushing the update button every so often.
>Now then, it would take me WELL over a week to learn linux and be able to do the same things.
Ah, I see. You can pontificate without ever having actually tried using it. Thanks. Good to know.
Move along. Nothing to see here.
Oh, in case you do want to try it, slurp down a couple or three Live CDs, plop one in the drive, tell the BIOS to boot from CD, then learn just how excruciatingly difficult - Not! - it is to run Linux, all without ever touching your existing OS on your hard drive. I too recommend Damn Small Linux. You might like Ubuntu as well. Me, I like Grml, but I suspect it's beyond your present capabilities (it's not intended for noobs). When you get over the shock, check out http://distrowatch.com - hope you've got a few years free time on your hands.
You might also take a look at PC-BSD (though it's not a live CD) or Freesbie (which is a live FreeBSD CD).
None of them will cost you a penny, all of them spit at viruses and malware, and any of them will pretty much run on anything. None of them phone home to the mother ship to be validated. Oh, and you can use the CD to install it on as many machines as you please. Burn copies and hand 'em out to your friends.
PS TC: Last I heard, Debian was up to 17,000 packages free to download, and the CD set (of which you really only need the first to install) is up to eleven. :-)
Ah, I see. You can pontificate without ever having actually tried using it. Thanks. Good to know.
Move along. Nothing to see here.
Oh, in case you do want to try it, slurp down a couple or three Live CDs, plop one in the drive, tell the BIOS to boot from CD, then learn just how excruciatingly difficult - Not! - it is to run Linux, all without ever touching your existing OS on your hard drive. I too recommend Damn Small Linux. You might like Ubuntu as well. Me, I like Grml, but I suspect it's beyond your present capabilities (it's not intended for noobs). When you get over the shock, check out http://distrowatch.com - hope you've got a few years free time on your hands.
You might also take a look at PC-BSD (though it's not a live CD) or Freesbie (which is a live FreeBSD CD).
None of them will cost you a penny, all of them spit at viruses and malware, and any of them will pretty much run on anything. None of them phone home to the mother ship to be validated. Oh, and you can use the CD to install it on as many machines as you please. Burn copies and hand 'em out to your friends.
PS TC: Last I heard, Debian was up to 17,000 packages free to download, and the CD set (of which you really only need the first to install) is up to eleven. :-)
Quoting:Your first assumption is that you will be required to buy anything. It makes no sense for Microsoft to try to make people pay for what would be considered "basic services" of the OS.
Please read the patent application IN FULL. Paying for basic services is *exactly* what MS patented here. It's not like you pay for an extra module to provide function X that you haven't got but really want. No, MS wants you to pay to take the throttle off the software you already have. Read the patent.
Here are some examples that MS *themselves* wrote in the patent application. I didn't think this up. MS did and you can read them yourself in the patent:
- If you buy extra RAM, you have to pay MS to make Windows actually use it - If you want to open extra windows, you have to pay MS because they limit how many windows you can have opened at the same time. - If you want to have several applications open at the same time, pay MS extra. - Stuff you have to pay extra for (separately): power management, removable memory support, a metered disk drive(*), number of processors supported, a screen resolution, screen color depth, and 3D acceleration, peripheral accessories, network interfaces, peer-to-peer networking, number of concurrent windows, a number of concurrent applications, advanced sound support, themes/styles, a game controller support, increased video memory, high speed disk access, network drive support, and network printing.
(*) Yes, metered. Too bad you got yourself some 250 Gb 300 Mbps SATA drives. They will only let you use it up to 40 Gb at 100 Mbps. Want them faster or bigger? Pay up!
- a suite support pack to improve the performance of utilities such as word processors. - patches/bug fixes/service packs (yes, you'll have to pay extra for patches) - the number of processors may be limited to one, or to a fixed performance level (Got a 3 Ghz dual-core CPU? Too bad. You can use 1 core at 2 Ghz. Want more? Pay up!) - DSL speeds up 500 kilobits per second, or speeds up to the maximum supported by the available hardware.
Also, mind this:
- add-on modules may be available for limited periods of time, based on the license terms
ProgramMax: While I question just how far MS is likely to go in gouging for modules (kinda like bobbing for apples, isn't it?) please don't waste your breath trying to tell us how long it took you to learn Linux at $10/hr. Besides, most people I know who make $10/hr have to pay the bills with that money. It normally takes them much, much longer to actually save the $300 for a retail copy of Windows. The myth that Windows is easier to use or even to learn is exactly that a long-proven myth, especially in light of the fact that the only people I've ever helped move to Linux barely grasp the difference between a click and a double-click. I spent 30 minutes teaching them how to use their system, including e-mail.
> And nobody complained.
Is that true? Or did their complaints fall on deaf ears? You might be correct; they may have just migrated quietly to another OS so as not to be viewed as complaining. Mind you, I'm not complaining at all. I have no reason to. I don't use that OS (well, I do at work, but I have complained as much as I can without getting fired).
> It makes no sense for Microsoft to try to make people pay for what would be considered "basic services" of the OS.
You're quite right. It doesn't. But that doesn't mean they won't try it. As for your view of "buying" features, I honestly feel for you. Really, my heart goes out to you. I know that's condescending, but we choose the Linux distro we want based on our needs and preferences. If our choice doesn't include a particular "module" (read "package" or "service") by default, adding it is usually a simple matter of using Synaptic, Yast or similar to install the module(s). But to pay extra (or worse, per seat) for remote desktop functionality? Give me a break! Never mind CALs for connecting to a server.
Besides, the simple fact that MS is seeking to patent a modular, DRM-ed system is proof that they are poised to gouge. It may not be as bad as the author portrays, but it sure won't be any fun for the users. The fact is that MS has been moving in the direction of adding new restrictions to what users can do with the software.
Oracle is not a function of the OS, is it? I thought that was a DB server. As for drivers, don't get me started. Windows printer drivers are a form of Hell all by themselves, even when it's supposed to be a "plug-n-play" printer. Besides, if you really think about it, there is an HCL for Windows, too. And good Windows admins do their homework and buy hardware on the HCL.
Look, I highly recommend you do some homework before you try to debate the merits of Linux vs. Windows here. All of us have extensive experience with both systems, and with non-techies who use both systems. You really sound like you're still learning Linux and are more comfortable with Windows. I honestly don't see how an experienced Linux user could still have the "buying" software mentality of the Windows world. Everyone knows you're only renting it anyway.
If you really want to throw more money at your computer, go ahead. If you want to sell your freedom, go ahead. That's your choice. Just please don't expect me to put any weight into your arguments as they stand.
> And nobody complained.
Is that true? Or did their complaints fall on deaf ears? You might be correct; they may have just migrated quietly to another OS so as not to be viewed as complaining. Mind you, I'm not complaining at all. I have no reason to. I don't use that OS (well, I do at work, but I have complained as much as I can without getting fired).
> It makes no sense for Microsoft to try to make people pay for what would be considered "basic services" of the OS.
You're quite right. It doesn't. But that doesn't mean they won't try it. As for your view of "buying" features, I honestly feel for you. Really, my heart goes out to you. I know that's condescending, but we choose the Linux distro we want based on our needs and preferences. If our choice doesn't include a particular "module" (read "package" or "service") by default, adding it is usually a simple matter of using Synaptic, Yast or similar to install the module(s). But to pay extra (or worse, per seat) for remote desktop functionality? Give me a break! Never mind CALs for connecting to a server.
Besides, the simple fact that MS is seeking to patent a modular, DRM-ed system is proof that they are poised to gouge. It may not be as bad as the author portrays, but it sure won't be any fun for the users. The fact is that MS has been moving in the direction of adding new restrictions to what users can do with the software.
Oracle is not a function of the OS, is it? I thought that was a DB server. As for drivers, don't get me started. Windows printer drivers are a form of Hell all by themselves, even when it's supposed to be a "plug-n-play" printer. Besides, if you really think about it, there is an HCL for Windows, too. And good Windows admins do their homework and buy hardware on the HCL.
Look, I highly recommend you do some homework before you try to debate the merits of Linux vs. Windows here. All of us have extensive experience with both systems, and with non-techies who use both systems. You really sound like you're still learning Linux and are more comfortable with Windows. I honestly don't see how an experienced Linux user could still have the "buying" software mentality of the Windows world. Everyone knows you're only renting it anyway.
If you really want to throw more money at your computer, go ahead. If you want to sell your freedom, go ahead. That's your choice. Just please don't expect me to put any weight into your arguments as they stand.
OK, a lot to read, but I'll start at the top...
> Your first assumption is that you will be required to buy anything. It makes no sense for Microsoft to try to make people pay for what would be considered "basic services" of the OS.
Why not. They do now. Or did you get XP for free?
>Your second assumption is that things won't be bundled. I'm not garunteeing that they are, but suppose I'm the average computer user and I want to just connect my thumb drive and it works. I wouldn't know that I have to buy a module for USB and another for memory management and another for the partition format and what not.
You won't need to. Microsoft will already have your credit card info from when you bought and registered the OS, and you'll be required to keep the machine connected to the network so the OS can authenticate itself to Micorosft on a regular basis. The OS will determine what modules you'll need, they'll be downloaded, and your credit card will be billed. All without any action on your part except using the system.
> In fact Linux is more expensive because my time isn't worthless...
It might as well be if you're using it to argue for Windows in this forum. Unless you're getting paid to do so, of course...
> And because it is easier to use it certainly doesn't seem customer-hostile.
I find Linux easier to use than Windows. Beauty is in the eye of the beholder. So is ease of use.
> How much is any of the functionallity offered by Oracle. Whoops. Not free.
Wrong. Or haven't you heard of MySQL and/or PostgreSQL? And those are only two options. There are others.
> And drivers aren't always provided so I guess I need to research the device and write my own, which will take at least two months.
So if I have devices which aren't supported under XP but are under Linux, this makes XP worth less than Linux? I think I have several lying around. Funny, they seemed to work fine under Windows 95.
> The time I spend costs money.
You know, you really need to learn the difference between "opportunity cost" and "cash outlay". Unfortunately, I'm not up to date on current economics textbooks, so I can't offer any suggestions.
> What every single Windows customer expects is to be able to buy, install, and run.
See my comment above. Oh, and you left off several items, as in, and pay, and pay, and pay, and pay....
> It seems pretty obvious that they will deliver that like they always have.
Which is exactly what tuxchick is saying.
I hope Microsoft is paying you well for your time. Otherwise, if I accept your viewpoint, you've just wasted enough of it to cover the cost of an upgrade to Vista.
> Your first assumption is that you will be required to buy anything. It makes no sense for Microsoft to try to make people pay for what would be considered "basic services" of the OS.
Why not. They do now. Or did you get XP for free?
>Your second assumption is that things won't be bundled. I'm not garunteeing that they are, but suppose I'm the average computer user and I want to just connect my thumb drive and it works. I wouldn't know that I have to buy a module for USB and another for memory management and another for the partition format and what not.
You won't need to. Microsoft will already have your credit card info from when you bought and registered the OS, and you'll be required to keep the machine connected to the network so the OS can authenticate itself to Micorosft on a regular basis. The OS will determine what modules you'll need, they'll be downloaded, and your credit card will be billed. All without any action on your part except using the system.
> In fact Linux is more expensive because my time isn't worthless...
It might as well be if you're using it to argue for Windows in this forum. Unless you're getting paid to do so, of course...
> And because it is easier to use it certainly doesn't seem customer-hostile.
I find Linux easier to use than Windows. Beauty is in the eye of the beholder. So is ease of use.
> How much is any of the functionallity offered by Oracle. Whoops. Not free.
Wrong. Or haven't you heard of MySQL and/or PostgreSQL? And those are only two options. There are others.
> And drivers aren't always provided so I guess I need to research the device and write my own, which will take at least two months.
So if I have devices which aren't supported under XP but are under Linux, this makes XP worth less than Linux? I think I have several lying around. Funny, they seemed to work fine under Windows 95.
> The time I spend costs money.
You know, you really need to learn the difference between "opportunity cost" and "cash outlay". Unfortunately, I'm not up to date on current economics textbooks, so I can't offer any suggestions.
> What every single Windows customer expects is to be able to buy, install, and run.
See my comment above. Oh, and you left off several items, as in, and pay, and pay, and pay, and pay....
> It seems pretty obvious that they will deliver that like they always have.
Which is exactly what tuxchick is saying.
I hope Microsoft is paying you well for your time. Otherwise, if I accept your viewpoint, you've just wasted enough of it to cover the cost of an upgrade to Vista.
A few notes:
-I can't consider the differences between different Windows versions as modular. With modularity, we mean, like back with Win95, when (as I was told) you could decide which parts of the OS to install or not, for _one_ and the same versions of Windows. Now, with Windows XP or Windows XP Pro, you can't configure what to install or what not, and you can't configure the kernel to leave out stuff you don't use. You can't configure it without a GUI.
-What Microsoft is patenting here, is the same as the MPAA/RIAA is doing with DRM: Taking away / restricting the rights you have today, and selling them back to you (again) and thereby earning more money. The only reason companies take away your rights with the goal of reselling them to you, is their business model, which in a capitalistic world requires the profit to grow every year. It is simple: that people pay money for MS products, means (for MS) they can try to ask more money for it, and the same amount of money maybe twice. This has worked for years. You, the customer, are their milk-cow. While the cow keeps looking healthy, you could retrieve more and more milk from it every month. It's not the task of the cow-milkers to meet the demands of the cow, or listening to the cow, as long as it is healthy, despite (not because) the cow-milker.
-With Linux, 95% of the software I use was for free, which means legal and gratis. With Windows, 95% of the software I used was cracked and illegal (I was a student with only around E100 per month to spend on other stuff than primary needs, mind you). If I would had to buy licenses for the software I used, which wasn't much shocking stuff beyond MatLab maybe, it would have costed me probably over 1500 euro's. Now, divide that by ten. Also, Windows is very vulnerable to identity theft malware, which would cost you much more than the money that equals the time learning Linux.
-If I spend ten hours at learning Linux, which may cost me more than buying one Windows License, I can install and use Linux for free on as many computers as I want. I can transfer it to any other PC I want. I can change hardware whenever I want, with whatever I want (as long as Linux support it). I can use Gentoo both as a desktop, workstation or a server, and I could let as many people log in to that server as I wanted to. I could distribute Linux to as much small clients as I want, without having to buy one CAL.
-Using Linux (and other free software like Firefox) instead of Windows probably saves me more than 10 hours a month, every month. That is mainly the case because you can configure it much better for your needs, and because of the choice of different software solutions (for example GUI/CLI) it offers you.
-Linux is tested for years, and build on years of experience. The technology Microsoft is pushing lately, like the software they will be using for 'paying per module' is not tested that much, and therefore, is a risk for its customers. Microsoft leaves their customers in the cold by delivering non-tested software (most of the time containing more bugs per line of programming code than Linux) and methods, and therefore is unreliable.
-I can't consider the differences between different Windows versions as modular. With modularity, we mean, like back with Win95, when (as I was told) you could decide which parts of the OS to install or not, for _one_ and the same versions of Windows. Now, with Windows XP or Windows XP Pro, you can't configure what to install or what not, and you can't configure the kernel to leave out stuff you don't use. You can't configure it without a GUI.
-What Microsoft is patenting here, is the same as the MPAA/RIAA is doing with DRM: Taking away / restricting the rights you have today, and selling them back to you (again) and thereby earning more money. The only reason companies take away your rights with the goal of reselling them to you, is their business model, which in a capitalistic world requires the profit to grow every year. It is simple: that people pay money for MS products, means (for MS) they can try to ask more money for it, and the same amount of money maybe twice. This has worked for years. You, the customer, are their milk-cow. While the cow keeps looking healthy, you could retrieve more and more milk from it every month. It's not the task of the cow-milkers to meet the demands of the cow, or listening to the cow, as long as it is healthy, despite (not because) the cow-milker.
-With Linux, 95% of the software I use was for free, which means legal and gratis. With Windows, 95% of the software I used was cracked and illegal (I was a student with only around E100 per month to spend on other stuff than primary needs, mind you). If I would had to buy licenses for the software I used, which wasn't much shocking stuff beyond MatLab maybe, it would have costed me probably over 1500 euro's. Now, divide that by ten. Also, Windows is very vulnerable to identity theft malware, which would cost you much more than the money that equals the time learning Linux.
-If I spend ten hours at learning Linux, which may cost me more than buying one Windows License, I can install and use Linux for free on as many computers as I want. I can transfer it to any other PC I want. I can change hardware whenever I want, with whatever I want (as long as Linux support it). I can use Gentoo both as a desktop, workstation or a server, and I could let as many people log in to that server as I wanted to. I could distribute Linux to as much small clients as I want, without having to buy one CAL.
-Using Linux (and other free software like Firefox) instead of Windows probably saves me more than 10 hours a month, every month. That is mainly the case because you can configure it much better for your needs, and because of the choice of different software solutions (for example GUI/CLI) it offers you.
-Linux is tested for years, and build on years of experience. The technology Microsoft is pushing lately, like the software they will be using for 'paying per module' is not tested that much, and therefore, is a risk for its customers. Microsoft leaves their customers in the cold by delivering non-tested software (most of the time containing more bugs per line of programming code than Linux) and methods, and therefore is unreliable.
> inclined to attack Microsoft than to use common sense.
Oh My, that would be far too easy :D
> How much is any of the functionality offered by Oracle
Opps, bad choice... How many individuals even use Oracle. So you just popped from the single user to the corporate giant, but ok... Ever hear of mysql? Many individuals and good size companies do use mysql, and guess what, it's free. If I use a knoda front end I have an equal to MS Access, but without the extensibility issues, and, I didn't pay another couple hundred for it. If I need it for more robust applications, heck, It's already running with most of the Apache websites out there. Don't like mysql, try postgres, or firebird. They, and a few others are available for 'free' (along with the drivers) in Linux and they already run some very large operations. Oh, and if your fortune 1000 Corporation 'really must' have Oracle, You can still use it on Linux.
> I am not really trying to be defensive. I'm trying to be logical.
Well, pardon, but you're not. You really need to have run both for a while (I and everyone here have) to understand that their is no comparison. Linux is the better OS with a number of superior and easy to use Desktops, security, stability, and flexibility; a truly enterprise worthy OS. Despite raking in all those big bucks, that's nothing that MS has ever achieved.
Or you can just keep paying MS their outrageous fees, be treated like a criminal under house arrest, and have the jailer dole out spoonfuls of gruel (for a stipend). It's your choice. I could care less.
> It seems pretty obvious that they will deliver that like they always have.
Deliver what? As I said, I've run both, and, MS is infinitely better at delivering grief to the user or the company. And, MS charges you for their problems. Perhaps they're really charging you for all the nice Trojans, virus, bugs and bloat... now it's apparently going to be for each of those 'services... How $pecial...
Oh My, that would be far too easy :D
> How much is any of the functionality offered by Oracle
Opps, bad choice... How many individuals even use Oracle. So you just popped from the single user to the corporate giant, but ok... Ever hear of mysql? Many individuals and good size companies do use mysql, and guess what, it's free. If I use a knoda front end I have an equal to MS Access, but without the extensibility issues, and, I didn't pay another couple hundred for it. If I need it for more robust applications, heck, It's already running with most of the Apache websites out there. Don't like mysql, try postgres, or firebird. They, and a few others are available for 'free' (along with the drivers) in Linux and they already run some very large operations. Oh, and if your fortune 1000 Corporation 'really must' have Oracle, You can still use it on Linux.
> I am not really trying to be defensive. I'm trying to be logical.
Well, pardon, but you're not. You really need to have run both for a while (I and everyone here have) to understand that their is no comparison. Linux is the better OS with a number of superior and easy to use Desktops, security, stability, and flexibility; a truly enterprise worthy OS. Despite raking in all those big bucks, that's nothing that MS has ever achieved.
Or you can just keep paying MS their outrageous fees, be treated like a criminal under house arrest, and have the jailer dole out spoonfuls of gruel (for a stipend). It's your choice. I could care less.
> It seems pretty obvious that they will deliver that like they always have.
Deliver what? As I said, I've run both, and, MS is infinitely better at delivering grief to the user or the company. And, MS charges you for their problems. Perhaps they're really charging you for all the nice Trojans, virus, bugs and bloat... now it's apparently going to be for each of those 'services... How $pecial...
> Unfortunately, I'm not up to date on current economics textbooks, so I can't offer any suggestions.
Three good choices: Hubbard and O'Brien Frank and Bernanke Krugman and Wells
Amazon has some good deals. Sorry, couldn't resist. The guy could *seriously* use one of these books.
Three good choices: Hubbard and O'Brien Frank and Bernanke Krugman and Wells
Amazon has some good deals. Sorry, couldn't resist. The guy could *seriously* use one of these books.
> The guy could *seriously* use one of these books.
He could 'seriously' use a PCLOS live CD, but then he probably doesn't have the time for even that... Oh well, he apparently has lots of money ;-)
He could 'seriously' use a PCLOS live CD, but then he probably doesn't have the time for even that... Oh well, he apparently has lots of money ;-)
I cry troll! A very uninformed or blinded troll. He's pretty well educated -- his post makes sense while his points don't. He is, none the less, a TROLL. You've been bitten by the troll, dudes (and dudettes)! ;-)
Sorry! (me crawls back under my rock)
Don K.
PS I am not OP nor would I ever play those games.
Sorry! (me crawls back under my rock)
Don K.
PS I am not OP nor would I ever play those games.
> I cry troll!
Not persistent enough for a troll. Maybe a MS rep, but in any case, he got an eyeful.
Not persistent enough for a troll. Maybe a MS rep, but in any case, he got an eyeful.
> Maybe a MS rep...
As indicated in my reply, that would be my guess. Anyone who values his time so highly but bothers to come to an obviously pro-Linux forum to extol the virtues of Windows is probably getting paid to do so.
As indicated in my reply, that would be my guess. Anyone who values his time so highly but bothers to come to an obviously pro-Linux forum to extol the virtues of Windows is probably getting paid to do so.
> pro-Linux forum
I don't understand that label at all. This is pro-Truth forum.
I don't understand that label at all. This is pro-Truth forum.
> probably getting paid to do so.
Once again, MS spends it's money poorly.
Once again, MS spends it's money poorly.
Now dek, no one would ever call you a troll. Maybe a nice gnome or sprite, but not troll. :)
Dontchya just hate it when people use arguments leftover from 1997? :-)
> This is pro-Truth forum.
We try bigg, but we all have biases, and it's good practice to admit to the ones you know about.
We try bigg, but we all have biases, and it's good practice to admit to the ones you know about.
"I never did give anybody hell. I just told the truth and they thought it was hell."
- Harry Truman
- Harry Truman
cracked version of Vista around US $8
Quoting:Tehran, Feb 5, Taliya News – Cracked version of Windows Vista is already available at Iranian software markets. Less than two months after presentation of last edited version of Microsoft Company’s latest operating system, Windows Vista and despite all anti-crack locks installed by that system’s designers, Iranian hackers managed to beat Microsoft’s anti-copying tricks and present the “fully cracked” version of this new Windows software to their Iranian clients! The copied version of Vista is presently presented by an Iranian software company and provides the possibility for its owner to have a private “Serial Number” and thus, to “legalize!” his cracked Windows copy. The retail sale price of the Iranian cracked version of Windows Vista is 80,000 Rials (around US $8) while this good’s original version is sold around $650 at world markets! This version of Windows is the first in its kind that enables the users to register his Windows “fully legally!!” at Microsoft website and take full advantage of that company’s after sale services, thus sacking over $640 of illegal benefit! We have still received no news on Microsoft officials’ reaction to the cracking of their final version of Windows Vista.http://www.taliyanews.com/en/archive/2007/02/iranian_hackers...
Why am I not surprised by this. What parts of Vista haven't been cracked yet? I think only bitlocker and the inability to run cheap Vista's in virtual enviroments remain. All the rest has been cracked, including "prototected media path"
Gives me lots of confidence in the security of Vista. If they can't even protect themselves, how the heck are they going to protect users?
> and the inability to run cheap Vista's in virtual enviroments remain.
Is that enforced in the code or only in the EULA? I'd expect it to be only an EULA prohibition.
Is that enforced in the code or only in the EULA? I'd expect it to be only an EULA prohibition.
I remember reading somewhere that it's in the code as well. Vista simply won't install on virtualized hardware. I could be wrong, but since we're talking about MS here the most likely possibility is that they have tried it in code as well.
I wonder how they tried it though. I know virtualizers such as VMware expose some kind of generic hardware to the OS, so presumably it can try to detect those, but I recall hardware-based VM's with hypervisors exposing the Real Thing (tm), making it impossible to detect the difference between real and fake hardware.
I wonder how they tried it though. I know virtualizers such as VMware expose some kind of generic hardware to the OS, so presumably it can try to detect those, but I recall hardware-based VM's with hypervisors exposing the Real Thing (tm), making it impossible to detect the difference between real and fake hardware.
This is great. At this rate, Vista won't be installable or usable by anyone.
Bleh - not interested anyway. I just nuked vista from a new HP DV6000 laptop to install SuSE 10.2, and am very happy with things. From my brief look at vista, I was reminded of that old chestnut "imitation is the sincerest form of flattery" - I saw hints of of GUI gadgets and decorations ripped off from OSX, KDE and enlightenment - but underneath it all, you still have that dorky little "C:>" drive, a peecee OS, and DRM galore. Thanks but no thanks.
herzeleid,
Did you at least get your refund for the unused Vista license?
Did you at least get your refund for the unused Vista license?
Ya coulda got a real box from one of the vendors in our DB. ;-) And without the MS Tax! May the fleas of a thousand camels infest your armpits! :-D
Humm... $8 huh. Still a bit high. Maybe with a $80 rebate I buy one and let it rot on the shelf ;-)
Quoting: Did you at least get your refund for the unused Vista license?I'd heard that it was more trouble than it was worth, and far from certain. If I could be assured of actually seeing a refund, I'd put the effort into it. Pointers?
herzeleid,
Actually, that's why I was asking you ... so I could use your experience... ;-)
Actually, that's why I was asking you ... so I could use your experience... ;-)
There are a few threads on this site about how to get a refund. Even if it's more trouble than it is (financially) worth you should do it, just to make a point (and to post it as an LXer feature :-)
But since you wiped the box, it's already too late. Photographic proof of you reading the EULA and clicking "I don't accept" are good things to have. You can still try but your chance of success has lessened quite a bit.
But since you wiped the box, it's already too late. Photographic proof of you reading the EULA and clicking "I don't accept" are good things to have. You can still try but your chance of success has lessened quite a bit.
and the M$ 'patenting-everything' goes on
"Sorry, no posts matched your criteria."
Microsoft patents granted on 06 February 2007
Tuesday February 06th 2007, 9:34 am
Filed under: Patents, Microsoft
29 US patents granted on 06 February 2007 and assigned to Microsoft 1 D536,346 Icon for a portion of a display screen 2 D536,345 Icon for a portion of a display screen 3 D536,344 Icon for a portion of a display screen 4 D536,343 Animated image for a portion of a display screen 5 D536,342 Image for a portion of a display screen 6 7,174,565 Negotiating secure connections through a proxy server 7 7,174,562 Interactive television triggers having connected content/disconnected content attribute 8 7,174,557 Method and apparatus for event distribution and event handling in an enterprise 9 7,174,554 Tools and methods for discovering race condition errors 10 7,174,540 Component dependency matrices 11 7,174,479 Method and system for rollback-free failure recovery of multi-step procedures 12 7,174,457 System and method for authenticating an operating system to a central processing unit, providing the CPU/OS with secure storage, and authenticating the CPU/OS to a third party 13 7,174,450 Network interface sharing methods and apparatuses that support kernel mode data traffic and user mode data traffic 14 7,174,449 Network interface sharing methods and apparatuses that support kernel mode data traffic and user mode data traffic 15 7,174,448 Network interface sharing methods and apparatuses that support kernel mode data traffic and user mode data traffic 16 7,174,420 Transaction-safe FAT file system 17 7,174,385 System and method for receiver-driven streaming in a peer-to-peer network 18 7,174,294 Speech platform architecture 19 7,174,292 Method of determining uncertainty associated with acoustic distortion-based noise reduction 20 7,174,288 Multi-modal entry of ideogrammatic languages 21 7,174,275 Scalability test and analysis 22 7,174,042 System and method for automatically recognizing electronic handwriting in an electronic document and converting to text 23 7,174,035 Rapid computer modeling of faces for animation 24 7,174,021 Systems and methods for providing secure server key operations 25 7,173,671 Selectively overlaying a user interface atop a video signal 26 7,173,637 Distance-based accelerated scrolling 27 7,173,623 System supporting animation of graphical display elements through animation object instances 28 7,173,619 Matching digital information flow to a human perception system 29 7,172,124 Camera-based barcode recognition
http://www.latestpatents.com/
29 US patents granted on 06 February 2007 and assigned to Microsoft 1 D536,346 Icon for a portion of a display screen 2 D536,345 Icon for a portion of a display screen 3 D536,344 Icon for a portion of a display screen 4 D536,343 Animated image for a portion of a display screen 5 D536,342 Image for a portion of a display screen 6 7,174,565 Negotiating secure connections through a proxy server 7 7,174,562 Interactive television triggers having connected content/disconnected content attribute 8 7,174,557 Method and apparatus for event distribution and event handling in an enterprise 9 7,174,554 Tools and methods for discovering race condition errors 10 7,174,540 Component dependency matrices 11 7,174,479 Method and system for rollback-free failure recovery of multi-step procedures 12 7,174,457 System and method for authenticating an operating system to a central processing unit, providing the CPU/OS with secure storage, and authenticating the CPU/OS to a third party 13 7,174,450 Network interface sharing methods and apparatuses that support kernel mode data traffic and user mode data traffic 14 7,174,449 Network interface sharing methods and apparatuses that support kernel mode data traffic and user mode data traffic 15 7,174,448 Network interface sharing methods and apparatuses that support kernel mode data traffic and user mode data traffic 16 7,174,420 Transaction-safe FAT file system 17 7,174,385 System and method for receiver-driven streaming in a peer-to-peer network 18 7,174,294 Speech platform architecture 19 7,174,292 Method of determining uncertainty associated with acoustic distortion-based noise reduction 20 7,174,288 Multi-modal entry of ideogrammatic languages 21 7,174,275 Scalability test and analysis 22 7,174,042 System and method for automatically recognizing electronic handwriting in an electronic document and converting to text 23 7,174,035 Rapid computer modeling of faces for animation 24 7,174,021 Systems and methods for providing secure server key operations 25 7,173,671 Selectively overlaying a user interface atop a video signal 26 7,173,637 Distance-based accelerated scrolling 27 7,173,623 System supporting animation of graphical display elements through animation object instances 28 7,173,619 Matching digital information flow to a human perception system 29 7,172,124 Camera-based barcode recognition
http://www.latestpatents.com/
Thanks for the post - there are two which give me pause:
7,174,294 and 7,174,292 (numbers 18 and 19).
Say what? at number 6....
Of course, lots of those sound like pretty common stuff...
Of course, lots of those sound like pretty common stuff...
Titles in Patents often sound like "common stuff" - you have to get into the actual claims to get a feel for their "uniqueness" or lack thereof.
Looking at items 1 through 5, I would think that it would be more appropriate that they be copyrighted or trademarked, but not patented (even if they talk about "design" of the things in question.)
38 US patents granted on 13 February 2007 and assigned to Microsoft
1 D536,727 Type font
2 D536,701 Icon for a portion of a display screen
3 D536,612 Package for an input device
4 7,178,163 Cross platform network authentication and authorization model
5 7,178,142 System and method for dynamically verifying the compatibility of a user interface resource
6 7,178,132 Forward walking through binary code to determine offsets for stack walking
7 7,178,111 Multi-planar three-dimensional user interface
8 7,178,104 System and method for generating structured documents in a non-linear manner
9 7,178,102 Representing latent data in an extensible markup language document
10 7,178,101 Content template system
11 7,178,061 Power failure detection and correction in a flash memory device
12 7,178,047 Method to reduce or eliminate audio interference from computer components
13 7,178,023 System and method to facilitate secure communication of data
14 7,178,018 Network interface sharing methods and apparatuses that support kernel mode data traffic and user mode data traffic
15 7,178,017 Network interface sharing methods and apparatuses that support kernel mode data traffic and user mode data traffic
16 7,177,958 Automated input determination
17 7,177,950 Synchronization and recovery of peers in a peer to peer environment
18 7,177,949 Template architecture and rendering engine for web browser access to databases
19 7,177,940 Representing a service discovery stream as an N-ary tree
20 7,177,938 Client version advertisement service for overriding default client version properties
21 7,177,859 Programming model for subscription services
22 7,177,847 Authorization token accompanying request and including constraint tied to request
23 7,177,845 Copy detection for digitally-formatted works
24 7,177,813 Middleware layer between speech related applications and engines
25 7,177,807 Middleware layer between speech related applications and engines
26 7,177,804 Sub-band voice codec with multi-stage codebooks and redundant coding
27 7,177,799 Semantic analysis system for interpreting linguistic structures output by a natural language linguistic analysis system
28 7,177,464 System and method for approximating pixel color utilizing an optimized octree
29 7,177,442 Methods and systems for fingerprinting digital data
30 7,177,271 Method and system for managing admission to a network
31 7,176,981 Selectively overlaying a user interface atop a video signal
32 7,176,943 Intelligent windows bumping method and system
33 7,176,941 Dropout control in subpixel rendering
34 7,176,930 Reducing fill and improving quality of interlaced displays using multi-sampling
35 7,176,925 Formatting object for modifying the visual attributes of visual objects to reflect data values
36 7,176,906 Method of generating digital ink thickness information
37 7,175,072 Strategies for handling transactions based on policies
38 7,174,928 Multi-part waste container apparatus
It looks like MS is either buying or nullifying the USPTO.
All of this software patients stuff needs to be dumped in the trashcan... Oh we can't? I see 'trashcan' is patented...
> It looks like MS is either buying or nullifying the USPTO.
Well, they started with the Justice Dept, the USPTO would be the next logical step, probably followed by the USPS.
Well, they started with the Justice Dept, the USPTO would be the next logical step, probably followed by the USPS.
I'm betting on the FCC before the USPS.
Quoting:All of this software patients stuff needs to be dumped in the trashcan... Oh we can't? I see 'trashcan' is patented...
that is a good one, chuckle.
35 US patents granted on 06 March 2007 and assigned to Microsoft
1 D537,836 Icon for a portion of a display screen
2 D537,835 Icon for a portion of a display screen
3 D537,833 Image for a portion of a display screen
4 D537,832 Image for a portion of a display screen
5 D537,830 Key configuration for an input device
6 D537,823 Electronic mouse
7 7,188,342 Server controlled branding of client software deployed over computer networks
8 7,188,340 Hybrid tree for mixed user interface elements and sequential data
9 7,188,319 Displaying graphical information and user selected properties on a computer interface
10 7,188,317 Dynamic multiple window display having independently linked windows
11 7,188,316 System and method for viewing and editing multi-value properties
12 7,188,309 Resolving document object collisions
13 7,188,254 Peer-to-peer authorization method
14 7,188,252 User editable consent
15 7,188,249 Derivation and quantization of robust non-local characteristics for blind watermarking
16 7,188,243 System and method for over the air configuration security
17 7,188,182 Selecting an appropriate transfer mechanism for transferring an object
18 7,188,172 Fast dynamic measurement of connection bandwidth using a pair of packets, a packet-pair bandwidth calculation and a list of recent bandwidth measurements
19 7,188,122 Live image server and client
20 7,188,112 Method, system, and apparatus for exposing server properties to a client application
21 7,188,096 Method for selecting terms from vocabularies in a category-based system
22 7,188,090 Drill-through queries from data mining model content
23 7,188,081 Electronic shopping basket
24 7,188,066 Speech controls for use with a speech system
25 7,188,065 Categorizer of content in digital signals
26 7,188,047 System and methods for providing histogram computation in a high precision rasterization data pipeline
27 7,187,925 Access point to access point range extension
28 7,187,845 Methods, systems and data structures for timecoding media samples
29 7,187,801 Multiple handwriting recognition engine selection
30 7,187,660 System and method for continuously provisioning a mobile device
31 7,187,384 Systems and methods for downloading custom or prefabricated processing routines to programmable graphics chips
32 7,187,382 Iteratively solving constraints in a font-hinting language
33 7,187,378 Determining the convex hull of convex polygons with congruent corresponding angles
34 7,187,377 Three-dimensional virtual tour method and system
35 7,187,358 Input device including a wheel assembly for scrolling an image in multiple directions
Hmm... This might going to be a long topic.
Quoting:31 7,187,384 Systems and methods for downloading custom or prefabricated processing routines to programmable graphics chips
I just glanced through this but this caught my attention. M$ has pattened downloading graphics drivers. It's a good thing that for the most part, those drivers are part of the kernel or X, and unless you want proprietary drivers, you don't actually have to download something.
@theboomboomcars -
It doesn't matter what the patent title is. Notice that several of these MS patents have the same title. What really matters are the *claims* in the patent. If you use an update mechanism for updating graphics drivers that differs from that presented in the claims of this patent, then you are *not* infringing on the patent.
By the time MS is done patenting their junk, the patent system will be nullified by their own same junk.
heh.
/me watches MS patent the patent process and sue the patent office
/me watches MS patent the patent process and sue the patent office
What about a patent for for patenting Obvious "innovations". The owner of that Patent could sue Microsoft for Patenting Obvious "innovations".
Russian legal expert, managed to patent vista...lol...
Quoting:A person having nothing to do with Microsoft, a Russian legal expert, managed to receive the official registration certificate on Windows Vista in the Federal Agency on intellectual property, patents and trade marks of Russia. He did it out of simple wish to show imperfection of the legislation system. The picture of the conforming certificate under number 2006613993 was sent to CNews. The problem is that the Russian legislation doesn't prohibit registering objects under identical names. However, according to Russian laws, such registration doesn't claim dominion over Windows Vista. Any possible problems are to be solved at the court, which will take other documents concerning authorship into account in order to define the right holder. source: [url=http://www.klerk.ru]http://www.klerk.ru[/quote][/url] http://www.russia-ic.com/news/show/3335/
Micro$oft forces-people-to-look-at-adverts-patent
Quoting:SOFTWARE BEHEMOTH Microsoft has applied for an odd patent which forces people to look at advertisements. Patent number 20070033102 uses face-recognition webcams to tell if users are paying attention to the advertisement. If they don't, then the software will disable or repossess the computer.http://uk.theinquirer.net/?article=37568
The patent says that it can make sure that paid advertising is watched. It involves asking users a question about an advertisement or requiring data about the advertisement to be entered.
The idea is that when the advertisement is correctly answered then cash will be sent to a user account.
The big idea is that schools will make a bit of cash on the side by forcing kids to become marketing guinea pigs and the patented technology will make sure they obey.
You can see the patent here. µ
> the software will disable or repossess the computer.
If that doesn't drive people to Linux, I don't know what will.
> The big idea is that schools will make a bit of cash on the side by forcing kids to become marketing guinea pigs and the patented technology will make sure they obey.
While I certainly don't think that brainwashing and whoring out our children is beyond MS's eventual plan, this patent doesn't aim at that. Just a fantasy that the Inquirer staff thought up.
If that doesn't drive people to Linux, I don't know what will.
> The big idea is that schools will make a bit of cash on the side by forcing kids to become marketing guinea pigs and the patented technology will make sure they obey.
While I certainly don't think that brainwashing and whoring out our children is beyond MS's eventual plan, this patent doesn't aim at that. Just a fantasy that the Inquirer staff thought up.
Microsoft bullying users into paying for patent licensing?
Quoting:Don Marti over at LinuxWorld mag interviewed Jeremy Allison last week. One of the most interesting points is the idea that Microsoft is strong-arming customers into paying for patent licenses without disclosing exactly what patents they own.http://weblog.infoworld.com/openresource/archives/2007/02/mi...
LinuxWorld: One of the persistent rumors that's going around is that certain large IT customers have already been paying Microsoft for patent licensing to cover their use of Linux, Samba and other free software projects. And the Novell deal -- isn't it just taking that and doing the same kind of thing wholesale?
Allison: Yes, that's true, actually. I mean I have had people come up to me and essentially off the record admit that they had been threatened by Microsoft and had got patent cross license and had essentially taken out a license for Microsoft patents on the free software that they were using, which they then cannot redistribute. I think that would be the restriction. I would have to look quite carefully. So, essentially that's not allowed. But they're not telling anyone about it. They're completely doing it off the record.
Posted by Dave Rosenberg on February 11, 2007 08:11 PM
nice - someday they will really piss somebody off that will bite back.
says a lot about a company that has to make money off of other people's work and not do a pinch of work themeslves except hire lawyers.
maybe this will be microsoft's new business model - just hire lawyers - file patents - then threaten lawsuits.
says a lot about a company that has to make money off of other people's work and not do a pinch of work themeslves except hire lawyers.
maybe this will be microsoft's new business model - just hire lawyers - file patents - then threaten lawsuits.
I get kind of wary when I hear "won't go on record" because that translates to me as "can't or won't back up what they're saying". You can't assess the quality of such testimony. For all we know, the people saying this to Jeremy may have just been telling him what he wanted to hear as a misguided show of support.
It's like when SCOG insisted on an NDA to see what turned out to be very flimsy evidence. They knew their evidence was weak, and tried to hide it from the world but still make it seem like they had a strong case.
It's like when SCOG insisted on an NDA to see what turned out to be very flimsy evidence. They knew their evidence was weak, and tried to hide it from the world but still make it seem like they had a strong case.
"Won't go on record" can mean exactly what DarrenR114 says. On the other hand, we can now see all the choicest bits of evidence in the Iowa Anti-trust trial: emails from Dell, HP, etc to MSFT, demonstrating to a casual observer that MSFT *does* strongarm even the biggest vendors. And when the vendors go public with a contrary opinion, MSFT punishes them.
So, "off the record" might just mean that these anonymous tipsters want people to know about it now, rather than at MSFT's next trial.
So, "off the record" might just mean that these anonymous tipsters want people to know about it now, rather than at MSFT's next trial.
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What a ridiculous century this is turning out to be. I wonder what price MS will charge to run the WinDebian installer.