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Free, Open, Eating Its Young
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Comments (4)
TC - Tthanks.
Gee dino, I'm not sure how to react. But I'll take it as good. :)
Seriously, a friend showed me the 'Geek Social Fallacies' and it all fell into place. It explains a lot.
I'm still marveling at a person who can put up a site called "Meankids", immediately lose control, and wonder why it's full of nasty stuff. I didn't say in the article "if you have delete powers, sheesh use them" because it seems obvious. But I guess it isn't obvious to everyone. Sure saves a lot of arguments. Especially if you have a strong focus from the start. It's harder to change an established community that has fallen into bad habits. For example, a friend who runs a Mac forum says there is this one crazy drunk guy who goes on these periodic rampages and drives everyone nuts. But if she even hints she wants to ban him, a lot of people rise to his defense- GSF#1 in action.
She said something else I wish I had thought of- that most online forums and lists have a specific purpose, and that reinforcing that purpose goes a long way towards keeping discussions on track and a reasonable level of civility without having to be the cop all the time. So then you have an solid, understandable basis for saying "we're here to talk about Macs, not deliver mental health services to troubled drunk guys."
Seriously, a friend showed me the 'Geek Social Fallacies' and it all fell into place. It explains a lot.
I'm still marveling at a person who can put up a site called "Meankids", immediately lose control, and wonder why it's full of nasty stuff. I didn't say in the article "if you have delete powers, sheesh use them" because it seems obvious. But I guess it isn't obvious to everyone. Sure saves a lot of arguments. Especially if you have a strong focus from the start. It's harder to change an established community that has fallen into bad habits. For example, a friend who runs a Mac forum says there is this one crazy drunk guy who goes on these periodic rampages and drives everyone nuts. But if she even hints she wants to ban him, a lot of people rise to his defense- GSF#1 in action.
She said something else I wish I had thought of- that most online forums and lists have a specific purpose, and that reinforcing that purpose goes a long way towards keeping discussions on track and a reasonable level of civility without having to be the cop all the time. So then you have an solid, understandable basis for saying "we're here to talk about Macs, not deliver mental health services to troubled drunk guys."
> But if she even hints she wants to ban him, a lot of people rise to his defense- GSF#1 in action.
I can understand GSF #1 completely. Most geeks have been through the exclusion thing a number o f times in their lives. They didn't like it then and they don't want to do it to others.
That said, if she's running the Mac forum, it's her decision to make. Why is she even bringing it up to the other users? Just ban him and be done with it.
I can understand GSF #1 completely. Most geeks have been through the exclusion thing a number o f times in their lives. They didn't like it then and they don't want to do it to others.
That said, if she's running the Mac forum, it's her decision to make. Why is she even bringing it up to the other users? Just ban him and be done with it.
Be the anti-venom
I have a wife. I have daughters. The images and posts that Kathy has shown chill me to the bone. I've read the joint statement that she and Chris Locke posted at the time of their CNN appearance. If Chris Locke did not participate in the posts, fine. He may have enabled them, though.
In other responses to this nightmare, Locke cites one of the oldest BBS doctrines around: "You own your own words" (YOYOW). Yes, I do. And abuse has no place in them. When someone attacks me instead of my ideas, they have crossed that line. I work very hard never to cross it myself. To me, name calling and threats demonstrate a lack of imagination, an inability to deal with the idea being discussed. That is not where I want to be.
So I encourage you to be the anti-venom. Don't feed the trolls. Don't participate in forums where trolling is encouraged. Don't tolerate personal abuse online. It's no different than personal abuse in the real world. Those are real people behind those posts, and you should *never* forget that. They are precious, their ideas are precious. You may not agree with them, you may not like them or their ideas. That is not a reason to hurt them.
One of the biggest reasons I participate in Ubuntu rather than Debian is the Ubuntu's Code of Conduct. You may find that silly, but I know that a reminder of that code has cooled off more than one shouting match on IRC or mailing lists, and returned them to a productive discussion. If you're in a position to gently make that reminder, you should.
I've been told that ignoring trolls is an effective way to get them to stop, but sometimes that seems like I'm tolerating an abusive situation. I don't have an easy answer for that. You'll have to make your own choice. Just don't be one of them.
Dave
I've been told that ignoring trolls is an effective way to get them to stop, but sometimes that seems like I'm tolerating an abusive situation. I don't have an easy answer for that. You'll have to make your own choice. Just don't be one of them.
Dave
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Oddly, going back to read it in this post Novell-Microsoft world is a bit of a revalation. I wonder how much of the reaction to that deal comes under the category of GSF3-5?
In the meantime, I am not going to kill you. Wouldn't want to, but wouldn't do it even if I wanted to.
I don't mind calling you names, but I prefer to say them out loud to my monitor where I can express anger and disgust in the heat of the moment. After I think for a moment, I will remember that you are a pretty smart person who has ticked me off. I might still be snide and sharp, but I won't question your parentage, won't confuse you with a dog or your profession with the oldest.
Some of that is respect for you and some of that is vanity. After all, I don't really want to look like a complete idiot.
Not that it stops me...just not in that way!