Dell is still anti Linux
|
| Author | Content |
|---|---|
| cyber_rigger May 13, 2007 2:11 PM EDT |
Dell is still "advertising" Linux and spamming us with MS Windows. This page image was taken 5/13/2007 http://www.flickr.com/photos/67085308@N00/496890631/ The "Dell Linux Desktop" link went here to MS Windows Vista machines. http://www.flickr.com/photos/67085308@N00/496872232/ http://www.dell.com/content/topics/segtopic.aspx/odg/odg_spe... I view this as blatant false advertising. |
| dcparris May 13, 2007 7:36 PM EDT |
cyber_rigger, I am not so sure it is intentional. I think there is more to it than meets the eye. Having been the victim of people putting words in mouth, I am not so quick to accuse of wrongdoing. However, I will see what else I can learn about this issue. |
| cyber_rigger May 13, 2007 9:17 PM EDT |
>I am not so sure it is intentional. Intentional or not, this is misleading. What if Dell advertised "Mac" or "Apple" instead of Linux? Would Mr. Jobs care? "Linux" is a copyrighted trademark, which in my opinion, Dell is infringing upon. Read this part, Quoting: WHEREAS, LMI was established and assigned rights by Mr. Torvalds for the express purpose of holding and exercising the exclusive right (a) to sublicense the use of the Trademark and goodwill to individuals and entities in order to protect the right of responsible persons to use the Trademark in connection with Authorized Goods/Services (as defined herein), and (b) to otherwise act for the benefit of the Linux community with respect to the Trademark; and...http://www.linuxmark.org/linux_sublicense.php Note the word "and" before (b). |
| dcparris May 14, 2007 7:48 AM EDT |
I think the difference here is that Dell can definitely make "Apple" and "Mac" negatives across the board. Otoh, Dell does in fact offer GNU/Linux on servers and corporate workstations. Now, I'm still not sure why they can't get the URL's correct. Still, I'll give Dell a little credit for at least working on the issue. Again, I'll spend some time this week looking into the issue a little further. |
| Aladdin_Sane May 14, 2007 12:44 PM EDT |
>Still, I'll give Dell a little credit for at least working on the issue. I think the problem has to do with segmentation (yes, like an annelid http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Annelida, Dell is notably segmented). An over-simple possible explanation: The source of the misleading ads I have seen is the "Consumer" segment. The Dell Linux systems are mainly sold (as of now) by the "Business" segment. The business systems are validated for various SLES and/or RHEL versions. The new Ubuntu-loaded systems will be consumer systems. SJVN's original article on this about the Google Dell Linux ads seemed to indicate that the ads were sort of a pre-sales sales pitch for the new consumer Ubuntu-installed systems; as in, the ads exist, but not the systems. Yet. Dell's apparent reaction to our complaints is much like that of a doctor or a computer tech -- If it hurts when you click there, don't click there. DC, JohnPatDell, in another thread, promised to try to fix this. Since, in yet another thread, he asserted irrefutably that I lack the big picture, I cannot now say the one thing that would have made sense of this at the time: LOL. For the others out there as naïve as I: To get this fixed it will take "forcing" (an amazing type of diplomacy that makes fixing hurt less than not yet still fails to be a CLM http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/CLM) the responsible party into fixing it, or escalating to their VP: ie, it is a management problem. Even then, Magic 8 Ball http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Magic_8_ball says the problem will take three months to two years to actually fix: I hope seven years experience inside of Dell at least gives me that much insight. CR, we all agree your complaint as valid, but I disagree that "anti-linux" is the right term for the problem; I see it more as "typical corp anti-competence." |
| dcparris May 14, 2007 1:08 PM EDT |
> DC, JohnPatDell, in another thread, promised to try to fix this. I have been communicating directly with JPD on this issue. Hence my understanding that this is not something that can be easily fixed in a day or two. JPD informs me that the keyword search issue is problematic. As you noted, they are heavily segmented, apparently each major business unit having its own marketing authority. When you combine these two factors, it just ain't as simple as one might think. And I agree with the corporate anti (or "in"?) competence. |
| dcparris May 14, 2007 10:28 PM EDT |
Actually, HP seems to be having problems in this area as well. I did a seach that turned up an HP ad. I have e-mailed Google to ask questions about misleading advertising links. |
| cyber_rigger May 15, 2007 7:23 AM EDT |
>but I disagree that "anti-linux" is the right term for the problem. I'll refine that to anti-desktop-Linux (protecting Microsoft's turf). The bait-and-switch tactics are nothing new. For years Dell and HP have played up their Linux involvement and then steered PC users away from Linux. I have 3 categories so far: 1. The disappearing Linux choice on the configuration page. 2. Phone conversations. I remember sales people pretending to not know what Linux is -- on the same day their company got Google headlines for Linux server sales. 3. Linux ads that redirect to MS Windows pages. I wish people would stop being apologists for these OEMs. Dell's desktop Linux hand needs to be called. I'll believe it when I see it. BTW, Dell's Windows-spamming Linux ads occurred well BEFORE the ideastorm decision to offer desktop Linux. I first documented these misleading ads Sep 06, 2006 http://lxer.com/module/forums/t/23609/ |
| dinotrac May 15, 2007 8:09 AM EDT |
>I wish people would stop being apologists for these OEMs. That's OK. I wish people would graduate from the conspiracy nut world view and learn that there's a lot more stupidity, rigidity, bureaucracy, needless complexity, apathy, incompetence, and just plain frustration in the world than they give it credit for. Large corporations, like government agencies, have it all in abundance. Even well-meaning and energetic individuals can get worn down by the reality of getting something done. I remember the early days of my IT career, when GM bought EDS. They supposedly wanted to inject some of our git'r done outlook and esprit de corps into the giant automaker. Ross Perot described it as trying to teach an elephant to tap dance. The GM folks thought they knew a lot more about business than those upstart EDSers, and Perot was ultimately bought out to the tune of $700 million. GM continues to make stellar decisions. Long winded way to say that the Dell folks might just be tryin' and failin'. |
| dcparris May 15, 2007 9:57 AM EDT |
Latest Update: Google has just sent an initial response to my inquiries. My contact there is working on my questions. |
| jrm May 15, 2007 12:50 PM EDT |
>I wish people would graduate from the conspiracy nut world view and learn that there's a lot more stupidity, rigidity, bureaucracy, needless complexity, apathy, incompetence, and just plain frustration in the world than they give it credit for. Are you saying that the two views are mutually exclusive? We have plenty of examples of Microsoft engaging in questionable business practices, and it also appears that MS is collapsing under its own bureaucratic weight. I don't know about Dell, but it's possible for both to be true. (Just because you're paranoid doesn't mean nobody is out to get you.) |
| dinotrac May 15, 2007 1:01 PM EDT |
>I don't know about Dell, but it's possible for both to be true. It absolutely possible for both to be true, but, in the absence of good evidence, you will be right far more often by assuming stupidity, laziness, or incompetence than conspiracy. |
| Sander_Marechal May 15, 2007 1:56 PM EDT |
"never attribute to malice what can adequately be explained by incompetence". I forgot who said that. |
| dinotrac May 15, 2007 2:16 PM EDT |
OK, so Wikipedia ain't like the Holy Grail of All Things Great and True, but, it chips in: A similar quotation appears in Robert A. Heinlein's 1941 short story "Logic of Empire" ("You have attributed conditions to villainy that simply result from stupidity"), and: Observations on the sway of human error over malice occur in various works. Goethe's The Sorrows of Young Werther (1774) mentions "...misunderstandings and neglect create more confusion in this world than trickery and malice. At any rate, the last two are certainly much less frequent." Albert Einstein also believed in the power of stupidity: "Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity, and I'm not sure about the former." |
| jrm May 15, 2007 4:46 PM EDT |
Goethe... isn't he the one who stole the disk compression algorithm for DOS 6.0? |
| Aladdin_Sane May 15, 2007 4:57 PM EDT |
>BTW, Dell's Windows-spamming Linux ads occurred well BEFORE the ideastorm decision to offer desktop Linux. I first documented these misleading ads Sep 06, 2006 [HYPERLINK@lxer.com] This I did not know. I apologize... |
Posting in this forum is limited to members of the group: [ForumMods, SITEADMINS, MEMBERS.]
Becoming a member of LXer is easy and free. Join Us!