The problem with the name
|
| Author | Content |
|---|---|
| caitlyn Oct 21, 2009 1:57 AM EDT |
The problem with honoring Emperor Constantine I's name is what it means to non-Christian groups. Constantine presided over the Council of Nicea. At the time the Jewish people had rebelled against Rome for the fourth time and once again the rebellion had to be put down at considerable cost. While Constantine may have proclaimed "religious tolerance" throughout the Empire that tolerance did not extend to rebellious Jews. The Council of Nicea determined what was and wasn't to be in the Christian Bible and codified the basis of European anti-Semitism for the next 15 centuries. The decision that Arianism was heresy also pretty much guaranteed that Judaism and Christianity would never reconcile in the view of one of my college history profs, a view I happen to share. So... a very unfortunate choice of name which, I must assume, comes from a Christian reading of history. It's interesting how much of what came out of Nicea the Catholic Church and many of the Orthodox churches did away with. For example, the books of Maccabees, which tell the story of the successful Jewish rebellion against the Seleucid Empire celebrated during the Jewish holiday of Hanukkah, are once again in the Catholic bible. (Protestant denominations still consider the books apocryphal.) It's easy to understand why a Roman emperor wouldn't want that story to be part of scripture. Today's Catholic Church is more interested in the miracles in the story, of course. Anyway, my point is that Constantine I had an awful lot of blood on his hands and what he accomplished in his life led to centuries of discrimination and suffering. Arians (followers of Arius, nothing to do with Nazism), of course, can't complain because they were wiped out for their heretical beliefs. |
| hkwint Oct 21, 2009 2:12 AM EDT |
Sad to hear, but probably to late to change I'm afraid? |
| caitlyn Oct 21, 2009 3:03 AM EDT |
Hans, you're probably right that they won't change it at this late date. I'm sure they didn't intend to offend but they clearly didn't do all their homework, either. |
| rahulsundaram Oct 21, 2009 11:36 AM EDT |
Caitlyn, I am afraid it is you who didn't do the homework :-) http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Releases/Names#Fedora_12_.28Co... |
| softwarejanitor Oct 21, 2009 12:00 PM EDT |
@caitlyn When I hear "Constantine" I think of the movie starring Keanu Reeves... :-) |
| bigg Oct 21, 2009 12:17 PM EDT |
@rahul: If so, then it was the author of the article who did not do his/her homework. And if so, this is the strangest choice of name I've ever seen. A quick search reveals nothing special about that county. |
| jdixon Oct 21, 2009 12:32 PM EDT |
> A quick search reveals nothing special about that county. Most likely one of the developers lives there, was born there, or some such. |
| rahulsundaram Oct 21, 2009 1:08 PM EDT |
No, nothing petty of that sort. The process is linked from the wiki page but it seems a couple of folks have missed it. http://marilyn.frields.org:8080/~paul/wordpress/?p=1393 Anybody from the community (you don't even have to be a Fedora contributor) can suggest a name. |
| caitlyn Oct 21, 2009 2:11 PM EDT |
@rahulsundaram: If you look at the history of Fedora names you will find famous historical individuals but no small towns in Michigan. I've done my homework and I believe the article is accurate. If the release was names Constantine, MI I'd have no complaints. Do you have any evidence that the article is inaccurate? Do you question the historical issues I've posted? |
| rahulsundaram Oct 21, 2009 2:18 PM EDT |
Caitlyn, I am not sure what you are suggesting. I linked to two pages. The first wiki page explains the connections and the second blog post goes into more details on the process. Since the codename as used in Fedora has nothing to do Roman emperors, I don't see whatever historical issues as relevant. Codenames are supposed to be fun trivia and nothing more. No need to get all worked up over it. On the other hand, if you want to do a good technical review, I would be interested. |
| caitlyn Oct 21, 2009 2:56 PM EDT |
Quoting:Since the codename as used in Fedora has nothing to do Roman emperors, Well, the author of the article disagrees with you. So do I based on Fedora's naming history. What evidence, other than one link, do you have that the author is wrong? |
| rahulsundaram Oct 21, 2009 3:07 PM EDT |
You seem hung up on the name. Alright, lets go further. I am a Fedora contributor and I already gave you the links to explain the process more History of Fedora release names and the connections between them http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/History_of_Fedora_release_name... Fedora Project does not randomly pick names. The names follow the guidelines as described in https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Guidelines_for_release_names The Fedora 12 codenames in particular come from https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Name_suggestions_for_Fedora_1... Hope that helps. |
| rijelkentaurus Oct 21, 2009 3:12 PM EDT |
The onus has to be on the person who wrote the article, Caitlyn. The link from Fedora's site specifically says it's named for the place in Michigan, and also points to a Wikipedia article detailing the numerous other items "Constantine" can reference, including Constantine The Great, as history references him. The author cites no references to a Red Hat manager or employee stating that their codename references the Roman emperor. And what about Fedora's naming history? Other than Leonidas (which actually references a ship in the US Navy), there is nothing like this in their naming history, they are about as innocuous as Debian. Werewolf? Cambridge? Sulphur? Moonshine? C'mon, you're being ridiculous and it seems that you're just wanting to start and maintain an argument...a potentially religious one at that. |
| caitlyn Oct 21, 2009 3:22 PM EDT |
No, I don't want to maintain an argument. It also isn't a religious argument but is more about tolerance, which is what the article claimed the name was really all about. The additional links were helpful, thank you. It does seem the article was all wet. My reaction to the article was just that, a reaction to a claim made in an article. If that claim wasn't true then my objection doesn't fit, does it? |
| rahulsundaram Oct 21, 2009 3:26 PM EDT |
Yes, which is what I tried to point out in the first place. I would encourage you to treat Register articles as amusing and entertaining rather than a accurate portrayal of anything. Now can I get your attention focused on a detailed technical review :-) |
| caitlyn Oct 21, 2009 3:30 PM EDT |
Of a beta? No, I don't review betas. It's intrinsically unfair to do so as we know there will be bugs. It's an unfinished work. |
| hkwint Oct 21, 2009 4:12 PM EDT |
I smell a next victim for my No-CDROM problem... |
| rsevenic Oct 21, 2009 8:28 PM EDT |
Constantine the Emperor or Constantine, Michigan? The second is a pointer to the first. Some of you STILL don't understand pointers! Hmm ... was the first a pointer to something further back? Likely. That was the nice thing about Occam2 - no pointers. Richard Arcana |
| caitlyn Oct 21, 2009 8:36 PM EDT |
I do understand. Someone wanting to name a distro release after a home town is completely different that directly honoring the memory of the emperor. Yes, that is undoubtedly where the name of the town came from. I guess I'd have a bone to pick with the town's founders but since they're long dead... |
| dinotrac Oct 21, 2009 11:23 PM EDT |
TOS. |
| jdixon Oct 22, 2009 10:15 AM EDT |
> The second is a pointer to the first. Some of you STILL don't understand pointers! Which is probably a pointer to his grandfather/uncle, which is probably a pointer to his grandfather/uncle, etc.,etc.,etc. And the original probably had nothing to do with anything. It's a name. It's been shared by probably thousands of people through the centuries. |
Posting in this forum is limited to members of the group: [ForumMods, SITEADMINS, MEMBERS.]
Becoming a member of LXer is easy and free. Join Us!