KDE 4.2: I'm tired of Pundits, Here's MY Take

to move my Linux noobs to it by the time the next version of Mandriva is released, until then they stay on MDV 2008.1, and if it's not Ill either move them to one of the Buntus with a GNOME desktop or keep them at MDV 2008.1.

What this bloke forgets, is that ther are now lots of Linux users who don't get involved in the forums, and don't do bug reports. Having an immature product like KDE4.0 as the default desktop was and is really stupid.

> Having an immature product like KDE4.0 as the default desktop was and is really stupid.

Yep. Had the distros waited for KDE 4.2 or 4.3, then things would have worked out much better.

I am using 4.1 now on MDV2009.0.. and have decided to give it a serious look, rather than the glance-and-spit method that seems to be popular among Linux curmudgeons.

I am having a world of fun with it. It's certainly different than the 3 series, but no less useful or functional. Just different. I made a few changes, like making Konqueror file management themes easily accessible, but I actually don't hate Dolphin for simple file stuff. In fact, it's probably a better choice for the casual user.

Some of the plasmoids have rather naff implementations, like the sticky notes one, but having these components as the central building blocks of the desktop actually means that in the long run, this will be a more flexible and costomisable desktop than any other.

Quoting:rather than the glance-and-spit method that seems to be popular among Linux curmudgeons.

This Linux curmudgeon spent a lot of time from Alpha 1 through to the final release of MDV 2009.0 trying KDE4 (4.1), and even tested it on a Linux noob user. 4.2 seems a lot better, and the issues that caused said noob to panic appear to have been resolved.

Oh, and this Linux curmudgeon is currently running MDV2009.1 with KDE4.2 in test mode as we speak.

Mileage varies, I guess.

My wife is competent as a computer user, but not the adventurous sort when it comes to power features and customisation, yet with KDE4 she has been ripping it up and customising it like a loon, whereas the 3.5 desktop on her other machine remains pretty much in its default state.

>yet with KDE4 she has been ripping it up and customising it like a loon, whereas the 3.5 desktop on her other machine remains pretty much in its default state.

There are 2 ways to take that, you know. Satisfied users tend not to muck around with something they like just fine.

In her case it's the "oh fun, i can do this" factor.

Quoting: Satisfied users tend not to muck around with something they like just fine.

True, but KDE users often like KDE because they can customize it to heck and back. I always tweaked the dickens out of KDE3, and now to KDE4 also. Good stuff, IMO. I am getting tired of Gnome on Ubuntu; the Kubuntu desktop is pretty good, though.

@jacog, mileage does indeed vary greatly from user to user.

One of the things I've liked about KDE since I started using it, is that the "look and feel" were customizable. Some said overly so.

As soon as I loaded one of the KDE4 demonstrations, I found that I loathed the new menu. So I looked for a way to turn it off. Sorry, no, no way to return to how the menu was displayed before.

That's not what I consider progress.

Bob, if I understand your gripe correctly, you just right click on the menu button and change it to the classic style.

Maybe now, not then.

If so, then it will be a major improvement for me. Luckily, 3.5 will be available for a long time, and maybe by the time 4 is required it will be configurable to the degree that I want it to be.

@Bob, I've discovered, at least on Mandriva, that certain applications; DigiKam, for example, don't work properly if you elect to install KDE3.5.10. and if you install KDE4 then install KDE3.5.10 or install KDE4 to get those apps to work, Konqueror becomes infected with Dolphin, and you lose the KDE3.x funtionality

I've elected to stay with MDV 2008.1, and kept my noobs there as well.

I am confused... how does Konqueror get infected with Dolphin? You can still use Konqueror pretty much the same as always. :/

Quoting:> Having an immature product like KDE4.0 as the default desktop was and is really stupid.

Yep. Had the distros waited for KDE 4.2 or 4.3, then things would have worked out much better.

Nope, I can't agree. You should listen to what the KDE-people themselves have said about this topic before.

If KDE 4.0 wouldn't have been the default desktop then 4.1 wouldn't even be ready today. Nobody would have used KDE 4.0 which meant not enough bug / usage reports which meant no improvement in the KDE4 branch, equaling a total standstill. Remember, KDE isn't a company like Apple or Microsoft or for that part Mozilla with enough money / fans to do the beta-testing, so they had to reside to this less popular method to reach a 'mature' KDE 4 implementation. Although, that's what the KDE-people themselves say.

@hkwint, another way to read that would be that it's a rush job. Instead of taking the time to beta test with people who wanted to beta test and/or knew they were beta testers, they squeezed out a pile, intentionally misguided almost all end users as to it's actual status, and used the resultant storm of monkey poo as the real beta test.

There is another group of people that push beta software out habitually as stable, they label the result Windows.

> Nope, I can't agree. You should listen to what the KDE-people themselves have said about this topic before.

> If KDE 4.0 wouldn't have been the default desktop then 4.1 wouldn't even be ready today.

Which is a problem for the KDE developers, not anyone else. KDE not having enough beta testers (though 4.0 didn't even qualify as a beta) isn't a problem for the distributors to solve. Offer it as an option if you want, but don't make it the default desktop until it's ready.

Quoting:If KDE 4.0 wouldn't have been the default desktop then 4.1 wouldn't even be ready today.

In the process they nearly lost a lot of new Linux users by doing so. They didn't lose my new Linux users, because I made sure KDE4 didn't cause them the angst it could have, by not allowing them to upgrade. What urinates me off is the unmitigated arrogance shown by some of the KDE people (the we should be ever so grateful to them attitude certainly came across when I was talking with one of them), and the sheer stupidity of the Distributors. Linux is no longer the exclusive domain of Geeks, and the Distributors, at least can't, if they want to continue the momentum that's building, do this sort of thing.

I think it works great, once I was able to see my desktop icons and stopped the single click. I am using the openSUSE 11.1 KDE 4.2 live CD which I installed in Vmware. I finally found a desktop set up I like on a Linux desktop. I don't have any of the effects enabled, but the hardware requirements may be a little steep as the installer said it needed at least 1GB of RAM. To get the normal desktop where you double click and see icons, right click and choose "Appearance Settings" and under "Desktop Activity", choose "Folder View."

I don't use desktop icons, and the plasmoids n the desktop are simply annoying.

Quoting:and the plasmoids n the desktop are simply annoying

Turn em off or don't use them :) I'm sure you already knew that though...but others seem to forget that they can.

@devnet: yes I do. Just pointing it out.

At the moment I'm not seeing a lot of useful functionality that wasn't there in 3.x, and some important, at least to me, functionality that is in 3.x still missing. 4.2 is at least usable as a day to day desktop, which 4.1 wasn't (and should never have been released by the Distributors - I blame them NOT the KDE devs - as the default desktop).

Bling doesn't excite me, couldn't give a rats about it, functionality does. If my desktop is functional and responsive then and only then will I look at whether bling can be added, if it detracts from responsiveness it goes, no matter how pretty.

Back to the plasmoids. It's a pity they are so damned annoying, because there is the possibility that I might want to use them at some point, but the annoyance factor is such that even if I find one that delivers something I find really useful, I wont be able to use it.