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Songbird drops Linux support
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Comments (22)
Cicero had the right idea.........."Cui bono"
In a case like this, follow the money trail. I personally do not use Songbird, but my daughter does. I feel this is a sad betrayal of principles on several levels, but it will take considerable digging to find the underlying reasons for this action.......But always, always.....who profits ? Certainly not Linux and its users but somewhere, somehow, there will be excellent fiscal reasons or pressures placed on the Songbird developers to cease support for Linux. It is just a matter of finding it.
What betrayal?
Had there been some promise that Songbird would always support Linux?
If not, there's no betrayal at all because anybody with active neurons should know that companies have to take care of business, and that means going where the money is.
Betrayal would require some reasonable basis for believing that they would do something else.
Had there been some promise that Songbird would always support Linux?
If not, there's no betrayal at all because anybody with active neurons should know that companies have to take care of business, and that means going where the money is.
Betrayal would require some reasonable basis for believing that they would do something else.
Hi Dinotrac..........betrayal in the sense of leaving in the lurch all those Linux users who were depending on Songbird.......That's for a start. Perhaps I am a purist, but I also see betrayal of ethics......or perhaps not, if money is all that is important. I'm old fashioned in that I always look for a sense of honour and integrity......but hey, this is business: honour, trust and integrity all get put to one side if profit is threatened. No...you are quite right, Songbird never entered into a contract to support Linux and therefore one should expect the worst possible result.......Is Songbird released as open source under the GPL or a proprietary binary ?
Money is all that important when you are a business.
It goes to the very essence of what a business is, and taking care of its stakeholders:
customers, to be sure, but also investors and employees.
And it's not all that simple. Was honor and integrity shoved aside? What commitment had been made to Linux users? Were there any actual paying Linux customers? How about honoring obligations to people who feed their families by working for you? Etc.
I understand very well the notion of being between a rock and a hard place. It forces you to make choices and live with the choices you make. It doesn't make you unethical.
customers, to be sure, but also investors and employees.
And it's not all that simple. Was honor and integrity shoved aside? What commitment had been made to Linux users? Were there any actual paying Linux customers? How about honoring obligations to people who feed their families by working for you? Etc.
I understand very well the notion of being between a rock and a hard place. It forces you to make choices and live with the choices you make. It doesn't make you unethical.
I do believe dinotrac, you are thoroughly enjoying picking holes in my "bland statements". :-) Oh sure.......for a business to survive there has to be a positive cash flow and we certainly agree on that. As regards "not that simple", I have already agreed that there was no committment to the Linux customers, but return with "how can you be certain that honour and integrity was not shoved aside". I certainly can't be certain. And I think you might be casting the debate net a little wider than needed. Choices may not be unethical, nor should the maker of the choice be tarred with the same brush either, however those choices may well produce results that can be labelled unethical, even if the choice was made for the best intentions; and commercial choices often appear very unethical from the consumer's perspective. Anyway, this is getting so off track, let's agree to drop it.
I cannot find the item again, but I saw it yesterday and it was a comment made on the removal of Songbird support that was very telling. The writer expressed amazement at the direction Songbird has chosen to go in that it is now trying to break into a Windows and Apple "market" that is dominated already by other software packages, especially ones owned by Microsoft and Apple. As the writer said, if Songbird had stayed with Linux, it virtually had open house and more or less had the chance to be THE software application in the Linux world. But perhaps it paid nothing. Who knows ?
Edit: Mea Culpa.......with capitals. :-) .....it is a remark by Sander_Marechal on the other thread, and I thought it was pretty good.
I cannot find the item again, but I saw it yesterday and it was a comment made on the removal of Songbird support that was very telling. The writer expressed amazement at the direction Songbird has chosen to go in that it is now trying to break into a Windows and Apple "market" that is dominated already by other software packages, especially ones owned by Microsoft and Apple. As the writer said, if Songbird had stayed with Linux, it virtually had open house and more or less had the chance to be THE software application in the Linux world. But perhaps it paid nothing. Who knows ?
Edit: Mea Culpa.......with capitals. :-) .....it is a remark by Sander_Marechal on the other thread, and I thought it was pretty good.
I can't be sure. It's why I asked what promises had been made. I don't actually care enough about Songbird to do the research.
> Is Songbird released as open source under the GPL or a proprietary binary ?
http://wiki.songbirdnest.com/Docs/Licensing_FAQ
It looks like the majority of the code, but perhaps not all, is GPL'ed. If that doesn't change, it should be possible to maintain a community version for Linux, if there's enough interest.
http://wiki.songbirdnest.com/Docs/Licensing_FAQ
It looks like the majority of the code, but perhaps not all, is GPL'ed. If that doesn't change, it should be possible to maintain a community version for Linux, if there's enough interest.
There is a community version called lyrebird. That will go on for Linux.
I'm 100% with dinotrac on this one. I spent five miserable months doing mainly Windows support (plus Netware) because, in this economy, someone wanted to pay me to do that and my usual Linux/UNIX gigs had all but disappeared. So, I could stick by the kind of "principles" Ridcully advocates or buy groceries, pay for my old ferrets' vet care and pay off my car. Guess what I did?
Right now I'm focused on Linux again, which is a good thing. Having said that, like everyone else, I have bills to pay and that means I'll do what it takes to make money. A business is made up of individuals with bills to pay too.
I'm 100% with dinotrac on this one. I spent five miserable months doing mainly Windows support (plus Netware) because, in this economy, someone wanted to pay me to do that and my usual Linux/UNIX gigs had all but disappeared. So, I could stick by the kind of "principles" Ridcully advocates or buy groceries, pay for my old ferrets' vet care and pay off my car. Guess what I did?
Right now I'm focused on Linux again, which is a good thing. Having said that, like everyone else, I have bills to pay and that means I'll do what it takes to make money. A business is made up of individuals with bills to pay too.
C'est la vie, say the old folks.
You never can tell. Chuck Berry
Companies with limited resources and a chance to make money will put their resources where the money is. That's what makes sense. That's the responsible thing to do.
It is the danger of any free project that is run by a company and/or primarily propelled by one.
Companies with limited resources and a chance to make money will put their resources where the money is. That's what makes sense. That's the responsible thing to do.
It is the danger of any free project that is run by a company and/or primarily propelled by one.
Problem is that Windows and MacOSX are problematic platforms to make money on. MacOSC users tend to prefer native applications. I've never met an OSX user who used anything besides iTunes. The problem on Windows is that there are a cr@pload of decent media players already available. WinAmp, Windows Media Player, iTunes, etcetera. It's a very competitive market that Songbird will have trouble competing in.
They could have owned the Linux market.
They could have owned the Linux market.
>They could have owned the Linux market.
So tell me who was going to pay for them to own the linux market?
Like it or not, there is not a very high demonstrated propensity for linux desktop users (and I am one) to pay for things -- especially when there are decent free alternatives.
So tell me who was going to pay for them to own the linux market?
Like it or not, there is not a very high demonstrated propensity for linux desktop users (and I am one) to pay for things -- especially when there are decent free alternatives.
If it's released under the GPL, doesn't that just mean that this particular group of developers decided to stop working on it? Can't someone else do it if it's that good?
@Dino: It's not about paying for the player. It's about buying content through the player. Given the booming business that is selling music on-line, there's a market out there. Even under Linux users (I'd be inclined to say even more so, since FOSS minded people care a little more about copyrights).
Quoting:So tell me who was going to pay for them to own the linux market?um.. who is going to pay them in the mac or windoze markets? It's a free app, right?
herzel --
I believe they have contracts with somebody....but I could easily be wrong.
I believe they have contracts with somebody....but I could easily be wrong.
~/o It was there that Pierre was married to the lovely mademoiselle
"C'est la vie", say the old folks, it goes to show you never can tell
Oh yeah, get up out of the chair and dance!
OMG Ubuntu says there is already a community fork, Lyrebird: http://www.omgubuntu.co.uk/2010/04/songbird-drops-linux-supp...
Oh yeah, get up out of the chair and dance!
OMG Ubuntu says there is already a community fork, Lyrebird: http://www.omgubuntu.co.uk/2010/04/songbird-drops-linux-supp...
Or would that be "Liar-bird"?
> "C'est la vie", say the old folks, it goes to show you never can tell...
So, whose version is the best? I've always been partial to the Emmylou Harris cover myself. Wikipedia says: Originally performed and released by Chuck Berry, the song has also been covered by Status Quo, Roch Voisine, Emmylou Harris, Bob Seger, Chely Wright , John Prine, New Riders of the Purple Sage and Bruce Springsteen. I've heard the Berry, Harris, and Seger versions.
So, whose version is the best? I've always been partial to the Emmylou Harris cover myself. Wikipedia says: Originally performed and released by Chuck Berry, the song has also been covered by Status Quo, Roch Voisine, Emmylou Harris, Bob Seger, Chely Wright , John Prine, New Riders of the Purple Sage and Bruce Springsteen. I've heard the Berry, Harris, and Seger versions.
jdixon -
I've always been fond of the Emmylou Harris version as well, but hey -- a great song is a great song.
I've always been fond of the Emmylou Harris version as well, but hey -- a great song is a great song.
Quoting:So, whose version is the best?
I don't know, but at least I'm certain the B*witched version was the worst.
> ...but at least I'm certain the B*witched version was the worst.
I've never heard it, but theirs isn't even the same song, as you tell if you search for the lyrics.
http://www.azlyrics.com/lyrics/bwitched/cestlavie.html
http://www.absolutelyrics.com/lyrics/view/bob_seger/c,27est_...
I've never heard it, but theirs isn't even the same song, as you tell if you search for the lyrics.
http://www.azlyrics.com/lyrics/bwitched/cestlavie.html
http://www.absolutelyrics.com/lyrics/view/bob_seger/c,27est_...
Indeed it's not the same song, together with their nationality that's why it's the worst!
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