Ubuntu versus Vista comparison

Quoting:Published May 6, 2007

The first few millions of us PC users have endured a few months inside the maw of the beast called Vista. During that time, some nasty downsides to Microsoft's Corp.'s no-longer-brand-new Windows operating system have become painfully apparent. .....................

Microsoft's geniuses probably think these messages sound helpful. Here's how they sound to me: "You can buy new software, Coates, or you can rot."

http://www.chicagotribune.com/business/chi-0705050032may06,1...

You should probably submit that link as a front page story. It's good enough to deserve it.

Coates is an interesting character.

He views his job, more or less, as helping Windows users to use Windows better. Oh, he might not put it that way -- he certainly likes Macs, for instance.

But...

Considering his long-time love affair with all things Microsoft, his recent positions demonstrate how badly Microsoft has screwed the pooch in recent years.

Because, more accurately, Coates is really helping ordinary non-technical computer users, the vast majority of whom are Windows users. As a matter of fact, he has even said nice things about the GIMP and OpenOffice in his columns.

Yup, that's one screwed pooch.

Funny. I sent him an e-mail suggesting he could free himself from the vexing Vista, by using a Mac, if not GNU/Linux. ;-)

Well, I'll tell ya. I have a new computer coming in on Wednesday, a purchase for my mother. I'm going to be installing Debian Etch on it, by her request. She's sick of the "fun and games" that Windows engenders.

However, it has Vista on it. This will be my first experience with Vista, and I'm not looking forward to it. The system will end up being dual-boot at best, Debian alone at worst, because she has some few games that she likes that are Windows only (that I haven't tested with WINE yet), and I have not had good luck with "dynamic" wifi under Linux (also "yet").

Being somewhat "old school" I still code the /etc/network/interfaces file by hand. But this is an absurd thing to expect a neophite to do, thus the dual-boot if dynamic wifi isn't at least as easy as it is in Windows (which is not always easy).

If all goes well, I'll post my experiences with the machine, maybe link it to LinuxOnLaptops.com

But oh dear, I am not looking forward to Vista. And this article goes far in telling me why. I loath DRM.

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I'll put in one big vote of confidence for HP laptops: They have, for this new machine, drivers online for Vista, XP and Win2K. Maybe, just maybe, they realize that people are going to be downgrading their OS away from Vista in large numbers. Too bad it ships with Vista. And yes, I did look for a Linux pre-installed machine, but the price was just too hard to beat.

As Jayne would say, "I got stupid, the money was too good."

Good luck Bob,

I have just set-up a computer as a host for a video surveillance network at one of the sites where I work that has Vista Home Ultimate on it and I luckily only have to work with the networking part of it. Which is still a pain in the butt.

I can only imagine the fun I would be having trying to get games and what-not to run on it...UGH!

The choice is only 'accept or deny'. Choice the one you know is right :D

What I hope for is that the Vista system has a "full system restore", which I am told (since it exists for my Sony Vaio XP "that came with it") is something that the OEMs added, not a standard part of XP.

Which is really too bad, because it was the only thing I liked about XP.

That way I could mess-up the dual-boot thing and still go back to a working system to try again.

It's too bad that Microsoft as the "let the person who sells it pay the Windows refund" policy, because I don't think the guy on Ebay I bought it from is going to go along with that. And the price was very hard to beat.

So I will in fact be "accepting", but I will not be reading the EULA. I don't care what it says, and they cannot prove I read it and agreed to it anyway.

But it's a "home" edition, so even stock Debian Etch is going to blow it away for functionality and usability. It is _only_ the wifi that has annoyed me in the past, and Cromm only knows what wifi driver is going to work on this thing anyway. I've done a google search for "linux dv6305" and I'm working my way through the derth of responses just to see how much of a mess I've gotten into.

"I got stupid, the money was just too good." ---Jayne, "Ariel"

Well, why not shell out an extra $50 and get a wifi PCMCIA card or USB dongle that's fully supported under Linux?

Sander, good suggestion. WalMart sells a Belkin USB Wireless Adapter for $35, F5D7050, ver. 4000, that works out of the box in newer distributions, including Fedora 7. As it is supported in Fedora I guess there is an open driver for it.

I'm currently using a Compaq Presario V6000 with an Intel PRO/Wireless 3945ABG. I have a partition that I switch distros on every now and then to test them out.

Last week, I installed Kubuntu 7.04 on it, and the wireless worked without any additions or modifications. Not only did it work on my home network, but it worked on my work network which uses WPA.

Don't know if Debian is using the same stuff, but this is the first distro I've used in which the wireless "just works."

the intel wireless works with a lot of distros 'out of the box' for the last 6-9 months. Try Vector Linux, Zenwalk Linux, PCLOS 2007, Sam Linux 2007 they have all worked for me. There are probably dozens more.

I think the latest Ubuntu has broadcomm support built-in, but I don't have a box to try it on. The broadcomm cards are common on HP and compaq notebooks.

Haven't tried Vector, Zenwalk, or Sam. Tried PCLOS a few months back, but I don't think 2007 was out at that point. Tried Ubuntu 7.04 and the wireless worked, but WPA support wasn't included (but worked when I added it.) Never did get WPA working in MEPIS, Freespire, or Sabayon. That covers the last 6 months or so.

Now, admittedly, I don't have the time to really work on these things the way I would like. So, some of them may have worked with a little more effort.

Yes, I noticed someone else writing, in a different but recent model, that they were using the Broadcomm cards.

If they are working, it means that the kernel network drivers are working, which is good. They're all using right around 2.6.18, which is also in Debian Etch, so I have reasonable expectations.

The only reason I don't want to go Ubuntu is that I'm more comfortable in KDE.

Kubuntu uses the KDE network front ends, so does Knoppix. When I last used Knoppix, it _wanted_ to work, but the encryption layer just wouldn't run. We'll see how things work if I leave the configuration alone (really hard to do). I noticed that the /etc/network/interfaces file in an Etch install has only dynamic, as in autodetection, statements. Nothing explicit, allowing for other software to do all the configuration. Certainly the Kwin and Kwireless front-ends have all the needed functionality available, if they work.

I'll let you know.

>Don't know if Debian is using the same stuff, but this is the first distro I've used in which the wireless "just works."

Well, it would be more accurate to say it just works if it works.

If, however, you have a wireless dongle based on the Realtek 8187b (as opposed to the 8187l), it doesn't.

If you have a wireless/non-wireless card/dongle or noteobook with built-in wireless based on on the ET1301, it doesn't.

Etc.

So...

Things are better, but they aren't great yet.

PS --

If you fall into one of the above categories:

the et1301 can be made to work. Users have put together a series of patches that get it working up through 2.6.20.

The 8187b works up through 2.6.18 at least. I am presently hacking away at the rather crappy vendor-provided driver to convince it that 2.6.21 is not the end of the world.

Try doing THAT with Vista!

Just FYI, this morning my mother's new computer showed up. After the near-endless setup process, I finally had the machine ready to make a set of system restore disks.

So I followed the instructions and launched "Recovery Disk Maker".

Right on cue, the security manager dims the screen and pops up a warning:

"Recovery Disk Maker is trying to run. If you started Recovery Disk Maker, press OK."

I hate it, hate it, hate it. But at least it will write the recovery disk image(s) to a single dual-layer DVD, which I just happen to have one spare one sitting around. :^)

As soon as it's finished writing the disk, that's it for Vista for a while. Period. Yuck! I would _MUCH_ rather have a clean Linux install than have to put up with dual booting _THAT_ piece of shi^H^Hoftware.