Review: KDE 4: Wow Factor Fully Engaged

Quoting:The things is if the idea of the new menu is to make it easier for people who have difficulties navigating a mouse, then it should have been part of the Accessibility features, not the default menu system.

Though a good idea, it would make more sense to make the 'easy for beginners' start menu the default one, as beginners will have more difficulties changing it than 'intermediate / pro' users.

Anyway, though some of you might not believe it as it seems you are a - varying from bit to completely - rusted in the way you use and think of the the start menu, there are good reasons to change it.

You should read http://web.archive.org/web/20050610031031/http://www.symphon... (darn, that was hard to find) if you want to know more about usability; it all has a reason. However, if you are used to little usability, it doesn't seem to make sense. For example, I never use a file explorer to work with files (no, not even in the console), I always use the CLI to do that. It would be quicker and more efficient to do it in a file explorer, but since I am used to using the CLI and still have to find my way around in file explorers, I still use the CLI. Of course I can understand other people like to point, click and drag when working with files, and that a GUI may provide more usability (though that depends on your view of usability). Oh, darn, I could have made this point a lot easier: Some people are rusted using Windows, and even though Linux may provide them with more usability, they dislike anything they see after using it only once (Nah, this is not as in Windows, I like it more the way it's done in Windows), not willing to _really_ try it out for a month or so and only after that judge it. Of the people who really try Linux for more than a month, a lot of them keep using it as far as I heard. A lot of LXer readers blame Windows users stubbornly staying with an inferior system, but how about Linux users staying stubbornly with an inferior system?

Same for a Dvorak layout for the ones being able to type blindly in QWERTY. One day using it is toughest hell, it makes your fingers almost think about suicide. One month means you really get frustrated of everything QWERTY, and judge QWERTY as the biggest crap ever puth forth by mankind (and when it comes to usability that makes sense). Still the world uses QWERTY, though it provides less usability. Why? Because users are completely rusted (apart from network effects creating an effective lock-in).

So when trying to judge about usability of a start menu, you should study a group of people who never used a start menu before, making them unbiased, in contrary to 'us', long time users of the old Apple-style (heard that, not sure) start menu.

Anyway, here what the guy behind SymphonyOS wrote about the case:

"2.Nested menus are evil. A good user interface will eliminate nested menus since humans have a hard time targeting menus in the first place, let alone panning up, then scrubbing to the right or left in a 20 pixel wide corridor."

OK, KDE doesn't 't use the SymphonyOS solution, but at least they tried to make an improvement, which is perceived as a deterioration. A lot of good things are thought of as a deterioration at first; and that's especially true for user interfaces I have discovered in practice.

All that doesn't mean I'm a huge fan of the new style start menu (that's why I mainly use keyboard shortcuts in fact or type the name of the exec, I never use a start menu at all on Linux, except when shortcuts have broken) or KDE4 (I don't use KDE, Gnome or XFCE, but do use some KDE-apps). I'm just trying to make the point it's not fair to judge this new menu after using it only one day if you have used the old style for almost all your life.

I guess my persistence is paying off.

Tracyanne not only wanted to close the chapter of discussing a new menu, she also went further to close the book.

I wasn't being stubborn, I persisted just to keep the discussion going to bring out a better menu than what we have now. I glad others are joining the discussion.

Quoting:I think it is good that they are trying to make the menu more efficient and easier to use, but the tasty menu is not there yet.

theboomboomcars,

I agree, it is not there yet, but with good discussions and feedback, it will get better.

Quoting:Also, the new style menus are less "scannable". It's harder to find something if you're not sure where it is. With a traditional menu you can move your mouse around a bit and very quickly flip through all of the menus searching what you're looking for. With the new menus it's far more work because you have to click back-and-forth all the time.

Sander I believe what you are talking about is not the implementation Tasty Menu in Linuxmint.

Linuxmint implementation has the following features:

One click to launch the menu; It stays until you click outside the menu area.

you get three panes; Search and Favorites for quick select/launch of an application or group of applications

2nd pane is for application groups, which you only need hover over to display applications and application sub-groups in the third pane. So you don't have to make another click if the application you are looking for is already in the list. However, you do have to click to see a sub-sub-list, which could be made to open another cascading menu.

Keep in mind that the menu stays open until you close it by a click on the outside. How many times have I missed on selecting an item in sub-group menu! Many many times and it is annoying like heck. Blame it on old age or physical disability.

Another advantage this menu has is the extensive configuration features that makes it very attractive to many. Changing the size of the panes, and other parameters would be great. Making it flexible to remove or park panes would also be good thing. It is a good start.

My point is not to force it on everyone, but to encourage the creation of a menu that would be suitable and liked by many users. Every one has different needs, preferences and working environments. One frigid menu will not be good enough.

A kick-off menu is very important since it is the entry point, the door, to using the desktop environment. We need a better one than what we have. A flexible menu like Tasty would be a very good starting point.

The developers should be given the chance to get it right. They will have this chance when we, as users, give them constructive feedback and criticism. Closing the chapter on them is not the right approach.