It's released.... and it's broken
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| Author | Content |
|---|---|
| caitlyn Apr 29, 2010 3:03 PM EDT |
The Ubuntu team has had to do a rush respin of Leaping Lemmings... err... Lucid Lynx because of a bug which would mean that on dual/multi-boot systems the other operating systems would be cheerfully ignored. See: http://www.phoronix.com/scan.php?page=news_item&px=ODE5Ng New isos may be appearing as I write this. Why does anyone have to get this on release day? Why is keeping the release date more important than fixing a serious bug? I'll never understand the Ubuntu developers, and this exemplifies why I no longer recommend the distro at all. Meanwhile the Mandriva team have pushed back the release date for 2010.1 to the 3rd of June. They seem to be putting having a working release first. |
| penguinist Apr 29, 2010 3:11 PM EDT |
I think the respin was completed. That's why the release was delayed until later in the day. |
| azerthoth Apr 29, 2010 3:12 PM EDT |
thread topic: It's Ubuntu, it's a given. |
| caitlyn Apr 29, 2010 3:26 PM EDT |
@penguinist: Read the article. They didn't respin all the isos. If you want kubuntu or xubuntu AFAIK it's still borked. |
| penguinist Apr 29, 2010 3:39 PM EDT |
So then, caitlyn, I understand you now. You are saying that the Ubuntu releases are respun and ready for download, but if you want kubuntu or xubuntu you might have to wait a bit. |
| bubblehead74 Apr 29, 2010 3:43 PM EDT |
Kubuntu is not affected by this bug. Xubuntu us a minor release, and Server is not used by newbies. I think they dealt with the situation the best they could. |
| caitlyn Apr 29, 2010 3:58 PM EDT |
Server is not used by newbies. It's used by businesses. They are still the main revenue engine for Linux companies. What makes Xubuntu "minor"? Canonical treats it exactly the same way they treat Kubuntu and Edubuntu? How is Kubuntu unaffected? It uses grub2, doesn't it? Actually, I think they handed the situation very poorly. They let broken garbage go out rather than hold a release for a single day. That, in a nutshell, sums up everything that is wrong with Canonical and Ubuntu. Quality is often an afterthought rather than the primary goal. |
| Steven_Rosenber Apr 29, 2010 4:00 PM EDT |
If Debian Squeeze wasn't also using grub2, I'd think there was some kind of conspiracy afoot. |
| bubblehead74 Apr 29, 2010 4:09 PM EDT |
Caitlyn, you are incorrect about Kubuntu, and to say they let out broken garbage is completely unfounded. It is obvious that you are biased. |
| TxtEdMacs Apr 29, 2010 4:27 PM EDT |
Bubblehead ...??? Caitlyn -- biased, probably. However, I am not certain about the wrong part. Look back a day or two at Steven's experiences with the release candidates. From his descriptions I am more skeptical of the reports of excellence than those that report single, but significant bug inclusions. In the case of the first Long Term Support release, it missed its target by two months. Perhaps a day or two late this time might have been the better choice. My policy is wait a month or two, if the screaming and mashing of teeth subsides I will try it, though this time I may try Mint and then take a look again at Debian before making a choice. YBT |
| padrian Apr 29, 2010 4:30 PM EDT |
:( wireless is not working for eee pc 901 model. |
| bubblehead74 Apr 29, 2010 4:44 PM EDT |
@TxtEdmacs: Some bugs will surface for sure. However, I did not encounter any, except for some problems with Ubuntu One. I can say that this is the best OS (not Linux but OS) I have ever used on desktop by a mile. [Here goes my bias:-)] I just can't understand, why it is called garbage. Your policy sounds good as well, although I don't think you need to worry too much. The maintainers said that Kubuntu us unaffected, so I believe them. |
| bigg Apr 29, 2010 4:48 PM EDT |
No offense, but what's the deal with Ubuntu fans. I request an addition to the LXer TOS that "it works for me" is off-limits when discussing problems with Ubuntu. |
| tuxchick Apr 29, 2010 5:05 PM EDT |
I can't agree with that, bigg, because that would eliminate half the comments in Ubuntu threads. Oh wait.... |
| bubblehead74 Apr 29, 2010 5:07 PM EDT |
OK, OK! Enjoy your web site. Bye! |
| number6x Apr 29, 2010 5:13 PM EDT |
I don't think the memory leak is fixed yet.
Xorg grows slowly the longer you are running. Just got a kernel update and rebooted.
top shows it gets a little larger every few hours. changed my swappiness and that is fine now. I only run Ubuntu on one laptop, no major issues so far. I'll keep an eye on the memory though. |
| tracyanne Apr 29, 2010 5:14 PM EDT |
Quoting:because that would eliminate half the comments in Ubuntu threads. Oh wait... I think that your jest says more than you think. |
| caitlyn Apr 29, 2010 5:42 PM EDT |
Quoting:OK, OK! Enjoy your web site. Bye! Are all Ubuntu fans spoiled children? It's beginning to seem that way to me. Oh, and "it works for me" except... and then he lists a problem. Problems and bugs really don't count when they are Ubuntu problems because Ubuntu is simply THE BEST because the fanbois says so. Yawn... Anyone notice that if you ever disagree with a fanbois you are "biased". |
| tracyanne Apr 29, 2010 6:19 PM EDT |
My Netbook seems to be now running the current release, after the last set of updates (today). Whatever the issue with X and Intel graphics cards was, I seem to have missed it entirely. I can't say I've ever had any show stopping issues with Ubuntu that I haven't had with any other Linux distro, but it's been a while now, anyway. I'll probably upgrade my own machine in a few days, but I'll wait until I can upgrade my partner's machine to Mint, she started on Mandriva (with KDE), when I first set her up with a computer, and doesn't like the top panel menu, so I either have to dick around with the panels or install something ike Xubuntu or Mint. No not Kubuntu, I really haven't warmed to KDE4 in spite of the good things being said about 4.4, it (KDE4)doesn't work very well on a VM, and if I can't explore it's functionality there, I won't install it on real hardware. I did try kubuntu netbook version, with the KDE netbook desktop, I thought it rather cumbersome to use. @bubblehead74, if you are still viewing this site... get a life. |
| flufferbeer Apr 29, 2010 6:21 PM EDT |
YAY! The floodgates of Ubuntu comments and posts, pro and con, are FINALLY released! Whoop-de-do to the big rush to download or cutdown Lucid Lynx (Leaping Lemmings).....Oh boy!! (and oh girl!) -fb |
| azerthoth Apr 29, 2010 6:35 PM EDT |
Still waiting for Perverted Penguin, I said I wouldn't touch it again until they released that specific name, and I meant it. |
| smallboxadmin Apr 29, 2010 6:37 PM EDT |
Well, just to make everyone more excited. I just installed on my work machine (Dell Optiplex 755) and dual boot w/Win7 Ent. looks good. Lucid Lynx looks awesome, but we'll see if it's as good as I anticipate it should be. Flash works, Quicktime works, other video's work. This weekend I have three more machines to upgrade (desktop, laptop, and netbook) and will probably test server next week. |
| tuxchick Apr 29, 2010 6:41 PM EDT |
This was a pretty minor bug and they fixed it fast. Nobody crabs at Fedora for their Grub implementation, which automagically finds Windowses and adds them to the boot menu, but not other Linuxes. Buzz is good for all Linuxes. Carry on! |
| krisum Apr 29, 2010 7:04 PM EDT |
If only MS Windows would not have been listed by GRUB2 due to the bug, then it would have been a feature :) @caitlyn Seriously, your repeated diatribes on the state of Ubuntu have become a bit tiresome now. Yes its clear over and over again that you are not particularly fond of Ubuntu and are a fan of RHEL x, so why not just ignore Ubuntu? |
| Steven_Rosenber Apr 29, 2010 7:34 PM EDT |
Ubuntu's the 2,000-pound elephant in the room. Whether it's true or not (and I tend to believe it is), Ubuntu represents the best hope of taking Linux mainstream on the desktop. That's why we all talk/write/kvetch about Ubuntu. As I say whenever I'm critical about Ubuntu, it is held to a higher standard - and I personally hold it to that standard as well. It's "Linux for Human Beings," as the slogan goes. With that claim comes great responsibility, and while Ubuntu is a relatively polished product, I personally don't think it — or any Linux distribution — is ready for real, non-geek "human beings" at this point. I first started using Linux because I had piles of computers but no Windows discs or licenses. Glad I discovered Linux (and eventually OpenBSD and FreeBSD), and I think as distros such as Ubuntu get better and better there will be more uptake with potential users. I just don't see any other distribution or company with the ambition (and money) of Ubuntu and Canonical going for the desktop market. Hence we all talk about it whether we like/love/hate it. |
| caitlyn Apr 29, 2010 8:30 PM EDT |
Thanks, Steven. You said it better than I could. Funny how nobody remembers when I was complimentary of 9.10 (Karmic) when it came out. The Ubuntu haters were all over me. Now if I write an article critical of Ubuntu or make a comment in a forum it's a "diatribe". LOL. Red Hat is the de facto standard in the enterprise with upwards of 70% of Linux installs, so I write about it. Ubuntu is the winner in the media hype wars and, at least in that respect, is the leader on the desktop, so I write about it. That won't change anytime soon. |
| hkwint Apr 29, 2010 8:56 PM EDT |
Darn, I missed the party. Are we finally allowed to discuss 10.04? Because I'm tired of all this waiting before articles about 10.04 finally appeared... |
| montezuma Apr 29, 2010 9:08 PM EDT |
Right Hans and I just have to vent. The latest sound volume indicator applet in 10.04 sucks and I hate purple. That is all. |
| jdixon Apr 29, 2010 9:42 PM EDT |
> Quality is often an afterthought rather than the primary goal. What can I say, they're obviously serious about replacing Microsoft on the desktop. |
| tuxchick Apr 29, 2010 9:51 PM EDT |
We're all members of the global diatribe! |
| tmx Apr 29, 2010 10:24 PM EDT |
Quoting:Right Hans and I just have to vent. The latest sound volume indicator applet in 10.04 sucks and I hate purple. That is all.That's aubergine to you, I had someone used that word on me today. Now that it's released, I hope there won't be so much Ubuntu news. |
| gus3 Apr 29, 2010 10:49 PM EDT |
Too late. As I type this, the latest 3 stories are all Ubuntu (although one of them is "is it b0rkz0r3d?"). |
| lcafiero Apr 30, 2010 1:04 AM EDT |
If I understand this correctly, the "bug" (apparently now fixed) involved not allowing Windows to boot in a dual-boot scenario. To me, that's a feature :-) |
| caitlyn Apr 30, 2010 1:33 AM EDT |
Quoting:If I understand this correctly, the "bug" (apparently now fixed) involved not allowing Windows to boot in a dual-boot scenario. Unfortunately it wasn't just Windows but any other OS: another Linux distro, BSD, you name it... While I appreciate how you feel about Windows (I feel the same way) for many newcomers to Linux maintaining a Windows partition is a security blanket that makes the changeover less frightening. |
| krisum Apr 30, 2010 2:38 AM EDT |
@caitlyn > Funny how nobody remembers when I was complimentary of 9.10 (Karmic) when it came out. Interestingly it was mostly based on "works for me". In any case it is unrelated. > Now if I write an article critical of Ubuntu or make a comment in a forum it's a "diatribe". LOL. An article and comment spelling the deficiencies is good -- I have written comments about the same in the past. This is turning into a "diatribe" because the same has been repeated many many times by yourself recently, namely QA of Ubuntu is not good etc. Its probably time for you (and some others) to move on. |
| caitlyn Apr 30, 2010 2:49 AM EDT |
@krisum: When you become my editor you will have the right to tell me what to write and what not to write. Not until then. |
| dinotrac Apr 30, 2010 10:01 AM EDT |
krisum - The proper time to move on is when the problems do likewise. |
| devnet Apr 30, 2010 10:13 AM EDT |
Quoting:Anyone notice that if you ever disagree with a fanbois you are "biased". You mean like my wife did when she tried Ubuntu and didn't like it and then got trashed by all the fanboys out there IN 2005? http://linux-blog.org/experiment-15-ubuntu-504-hoary-final-r... yes, I've been saying the same thing about those fanboys for 5 years now...although, my voice is getting weak and old :) |
| Steven_Rosenber Apr 30, 2010 4:29 PM EDT |
Ubuntu in particular and Linux distributions in general should pay more attention to fixing bugs AND preventing regressions when bugs are fixed and features are added. One of the reasons why most OSes have extremely long-term support (I'm thinking Windows and RHEL) is that new features and hardware support often break features and support for older hardware. Sure there's the possibility that regressions will be fixed in subsequent updates, but that doesn't happen in every (or maybe even in most) cases. Ubuntu's policy of releasing every six months yet keeping an LTS around for 3 years on the desktop is a nice compromise. The only wrinkle in this particular LTS, 10.04, is there are so many new features that Ubuntu could very well end up with an LTS release with too many regressions. But it has support for more new hardware now, and that will serve the release over the next couple of years of life. So it's a delicate balancing act for any software release. And it's the problems that affect us as individual users that end up getting a lot of attention in the blogs. What Linux, the kernel, and Xorg, the project, have done to users of "legacy" Intel video in service of giving users of more recent Intel video a better experience - it's nothing short of tragic. I'm no expert - and never claim to be one - but as a user I would've been much better served by Linux and Xorg leaving the i810 driver alone and using the newer Intel driver strictly for the newer chipsets. I went from auto-configured X in Debian Etch to needing a simple xorg.conf in Lenny and Ubuntu Gutsy to no xorg.conf AND working 3-D in Hardy to a slightly more complicated xorg.conf in Interpid, that xorg.conf and turning off kernel mode setting in Ubuntu Jaunty, and now back to no xorg.conf, still turning off kernel mode setting but NO 3-D in Debian Squeeze and Ubuntu Lucid. The short version: It's been a struggle to get Xorg to work properly since the 2.6.18 kernel. I've been persistent about keeping Linux and BSDs working on three laptops with Intel 830m chipsets, but how many users tried a live CD and were faced with a blank or artifact-marred screen and ran back to Windows? I bet many. So I'm not piling on Ubuntu here. Despite all the marketing, at many levels they're taking Debian Sid (or Squeeze) and doing a bit of rebranding and bolting on a few features. In turn, Debian is taking what's happening in thousands of upstream projects and putting it together the "Debian" way. Half of the fascination/angst over Ubuntu is the project's (and for-profit parent company's) own marketing. The other half is the fanboy army gushing over every new wallpaper. I think Ubuntu is a great project - probably one of the best FOSS projects ever. But when you're on top (as Ubuntu is in the Linux distro world at this point), expect people to look at you and say what they think. |
| tracyanne Apr 30, 2010 6:33 PM EDT |
@devnet I've just read Mrs Devnet's experience of Ubuntu 5.04. Interestinly that pretty much sums up my thoughts after I tried it. BTW I was comparing it with Mandrake, not Windows. |
| devnet May 02, 2010 11:22 PM EDT |
@tracyanne Odd how that happened with my wife so long ago yet most of the stuff is still valid today! |
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