I think I figured it out...

Story: tux500 is a pump-and-dump scamTotal Replies: 52
Author Content

Apr 17, 2007
3:37 PM EST
I think I figured out partly where the drivel is coming from. From PP's website:

Quoting: I'm sorry to break this to you, but your website sucks. You know why? Because you don't have Penguin Pete writing for you!

Don't let your copy succumb to stale cliches, exhausted metaphors, contrived alliteration, awkward similes, and a hash of managerial buzzwords. From a few posts of linkbait to a full 50,000-word eBook, an injection of verbiage from my keyboard will breathe new life into your online business and bring the web audience running.

They key word here being "linkbait". He hopes to raise a ton of fuss and have websites all over the world link to him, thereby giving a big boost to his site's pagerank. It's sort of like Enderle's reason for drivel but only with pagerank instead of adviews as the currency that the ethics were sold for.

How's THAT for drivel :-)


Apr 17, 2007
3:47 PM EST
sander, your good..

Apr 17, 2007
5:12 PM EST
LOL! Oh, so I suppose it would be better if I put up a thermometer and demanded that everybody send me donations totaling a third of a million?

Oh, shame on me, I work for a living! The disgrace!

Apr 17, 2007
5:13 PM EST
> so I suppose it would be better if I put up a thermometer

It would be better not to make specific accusations of criminal acts. That, bucko, is libel. Even in a blog.

Apr 17, 2007
6:12 PM EST
@PP The odds are good that you are now going to be subject to "just a few" accusations and threats (in one form or another) within this thread and within other similar LXer threads, all primarily in response to your 'tux500 is a pump-and-dump scam'. Currently less than a half-dozen of such response threads. Expect these responses not only from your originating LXer post here, but also via your own more recent 'the tux500 scam of the Linux community' post at http://penguinpetes.com/b2evo/index.php !

Perhaps responding to the first 'I think I figured it out...' comment above will NOT have been the best choice in lieu of these accusations and threats! FYI, this particular commentator has already discussed offline the material published in the allegedly-libeled campaigner's promotional websites linked at the top of your post ---- with negative/naysaying offline responses *against* the campaign openly and already communicated back at this time from "just a few" individuals. No need at this time for this one to rush to *urgently* discuss or "investigate" before May 21st your or the esteemed campaigners' polarizing blogs.

Apr 17, 2007
6:19 PM EST
Whether it's the real PP or a fake, he's still a weenie. Possibly a libelous weenie.

Apr 17, 2007
6:19 PM EST

The campaigner im question has been accused by pp of taking part in a conspiracy to conduct a criminal fraud. If pp can't prove that -- and I mean proof sufficient to satisfy a court of law, then there is no alleged about the libel.

Apr 17, 2007
6:30 PM EST
> Oh, shame on me, I work for a living!

So do telemarketers.

Apr 17, 2007
8:48 PM EST
This isn't a giant case of professional jealousy is it?

Somebody seen an idea and just can't bear that they didn't have it first and so must wreck it.

Devnet is a scallywag, as I've told him before, but a very nice scallywag and nothing about him makes me wary. (He's even eased off on the Ubuntu-rage). Helios is a wonderful example of enthusiasm and willingness and has gone several miles beyond what was ever required. Neither have ever done me any harm and both have taken the time to respond to me on the level (as far as I can tell).

Prior to this morning I'd not heard of Penguin Pete and thus far everything of his I've read has been negative and accusatory. (This is not a judgement, merely an observation).

Trashing other people ideas isn't work.

Apr 17, 2007
8:57 PM EST
Mr PP has added to his page. He now makes the accusation that both devnet and helios say "Pay us money, or we'll ruin your online reputation."

Think the man may have crossed a(nother) line there.

Apr 17, 2007
9:08 PM EST
Quoting:Oh, shame on me, I work for a living! The disgrace!

So do criminals, spammers and 419 fraudsters. I'm merely poining out that *anyone* can write drivel. And mine is a lot more believable than yours, which is just libel.

I hope that Helios has contacted Acceleration Marketing about this. These allegations are libelous and potentially damaging to Acceleration Marketing and they will have the lawyers to put an end to this nonsense.

Apr 18, 2007
2:40 AM EST
PenguinPetes has 'whoisprotection', no contact links, PenguinPete doesn't have a full name like Ken Starks does, he does censor his site. Only someone who is afraid does that stuff, not? PP may as well be called AnonymousCoward.

Apr 18, 2007
4:30 AM EST
Heh. Drivel. PP. Get it?

Apr 18, 2007
5:16 AM EST
>Heh. Drivel. PP. Get it?

So THAT's what he means when he says he's no. 1!

Apr 18, 2007
5:41 AM EST

Apr 18, 2007
12:33 PM EST
Quoting:Heh. Drivel. PP. Get it?

No? Did I make an unintentional pun?

Apr 18, 2007
4:59 PM EST
While we're bandying about legal terms have a look at:

"Extortion is a criminal offense, which occurs when a person either obtains money, property or services from another through coercion or intimidation..."

which is a quote from Wikipedia, and is what this entire campaign to collect money from the Linux community on threat of having their online reputation destroyed is.

In the thread "Make it Champ Car sponsorship and I'll donate $100" appended to the story "Linux Marketing Campaign Seeks $350k in 40 Days", what did top2percent do to deserve helios's wrath? Just recommend that the money be spent better, and cite his advice not being followed as the reason why he wasn't donating.

It ain't libel if it's true, and I link to a page supporting every fact I post. And if it makes me a bad guy to protest the sickening campaign of terror these crooks are carrying out to shake money out of people, then I'm damn proud to be one. I do NOT - on pain of DEATH - stand by and watch innocent people get hurt AND robbed. Take a lot more than a libel threat to back me down.

Sorry you don't like it!

Apr 18, 2007
5:09 PM EST
Seriously, did your mother drop you when you were a baby?

Apr 18, 2007
5:15 PM EST
> ...and is what this entire campaign to collect money from the Linux community on threat of having their online reputation destroyed is.

You're the only person I've seen claiming they've received such threats. Your evidence to date of your claims has been rather lacking.

> ...what did top2percent do to deserve helios's wrath?

You consider that wrath? How long have you been on the Internet again?

> It ain't libel if it's true...

Well, that's correct at least. Now, all you have to do is prove it, probably in court. Normally I'd wish someone facing such a task good luck, but in this case I think I'll refrain.

Apr 18, 2007
5:16 PM EST
bigg, more than once I'd say.

Apr 18, 2007
5:36 PM EST
> I link to a page supporting every fact I post

Well, you link to a lot of stuff. Most of it's rumor, debate and FUD, but, not much factual at all. As far as legal opinion, I'll take Dino's over yours any day.

What I can't understand is 'why'? What's causing you to foam at the mouth when Helois, a reputable member of the the Linux community, comes up with a plan to promote Linux? Are you jealous of the fact that he came up with an Idea that just might work? Do you just not like racing? Do you not want Linux to become popular? Or, are you just trying to raise your site's rating.

whatever the case, nothing excuses the vitriol that you've been spewing the last couple of days. Maybe bigg is right. Your mother did drop you on your head.

Apr 18, 2007
5:40 PM EST
> It ain't libel if it's true,

Yup. But the things you say about Ken bear as much resemblance to the truth as you bear to a man.

Apr 18, 2007
10:00 PM EST
Pretend you have a sense of humor and read this part: Reputable people don't need to have "a reputable member of the $foo community" appended to their names every time they are mentioned. You don't say, "Mother Teresa, a reputable member of the Catholic community"

Now seriously: Why am I foaming at the mouth at this? OK, I'm going to take that as a sign, without all the dropped-on-your-head lameness, that even one of you is ready to be reasonable and listen.

First, for the same reason quite a few other people posting to the site (THIS site alone!) answering the same thing: it's a hair-brained scheme that won't show return value. Do you know you can rent advertising space on a blimp, that fies over a whole city and doesn't need to qualify or get a pole position, for $500?


See elsewhere on LXer today where Michael Dell's new Linux system is posted? So, save the money, keep after Dell to offer that Linux machine for retail, and sponsor a "buy Linux" day where we each pledge to go to a computer store and purchase a retail Linux machine. I'm just throwing out examples.

Even if we stick with the present scheme. You people ever seen somebody collecting donations door to door or in front of a market? they're POLITE! "Hello, would you like to donate for our cause?" If the person doesn't toss in, it's "Thanks anyway" or "Sorry to trouble you." or "here's our card in case you change your mind. Have a nice day."

NOT shaking people down like a couple of Brooklyn hoods collecting numbers racket money! NOT going, "Oh, well, I guess you hate Linux, then." NOT hysterically screaming down everybody who even raises their hand and asks "Have we thought this through?" How about if somebody collecting for world hunger got turned down for a donation and started raving "Oh, well then I guess you hate little children and you're probably a racist and a bigot too!" How likely is the next person coming up to donate? Even if this were the real McCoy, you guys are dooming yourselves with the stupid way you're going about it.

What the heck are these? http://digg.com/users/bobm0831/news/dugg http://www.digg.com/users/Brinanne/news/dugg

You think people visiting Digg can't tell a rigging scheme when they see one? Profiles with new members whose sole action is to digg the tux500 stories. Oh, no, nothing unusual about that! Did you catch the Wired article a few weeks back where Analee Newitz paid a firm to rig Digg to promote a deliberate hoax blog? So it's no secret to the public that Digg can get rigged.

And helios' posts all over the place "Oh, excuse me, I know this isn't the place to post this, but it's an Official Press Release from a Reputable Member Of The Linux Community." and then the forum moderator is chewing him out about it? Great way to promote Linux, guys!

And that article on the Indy500 site? The holy grail I've been pointed to again and again and again, everyone's all "Look! It's on indy500.com, how much more confirmation do you need?"

Well, since you all ask so nicely, I'll give you a preview of what I'm posting tomorrow: my email back from the indy500 admin responding when I asked for the source of the tux500 news post: Quote:

"Thanks for your e-mail. The story about Chastain Motorsports' sponsorship for the Indianapolis 500 from the Linux community came from an Indianapolis-based marketing group, Acceleration Marketing...

The Indianapolis Motor Speedway is not providing official support for this project and is not involved in the sourcing and collection of funds. We simply ran the press release as we would for any Indianapolis 500 team seeking sponsors, especially a unique program like this one."


In other words, it's just a business card and a phone call harder than it is to post on Digg.

So, we're STILL back to two (2) bloggers, and one (1) marketing firm. Presumably hired by the bloggers, pray tell? $350K in a month for this? Why THIS year? Why not just collect funds all year and have a well-thought-out campaign for NEXT year, when we don't have to hustle it like Amway salesmen? Is this the closing year for the last Indy 500 race that will ever be held?

Why THIS driver, THIS race, THIS sport, THIS way of promoting Linux and any attempt to suggest the tiniest deviation from The Only Path gets sh*t thrown at it by a bunch of screaming howler monkeys? At this point it would be a terrible shame if it wasn't a scam. Because your name is definitely in the envelope in the category of "Most Outstanding Performance Portraying A Scam Artist"

And now, of course, you've all dug yourselves such a deep grave by now with all of your hype, hype, hype that if you even put it off til next year, you still look like big assholes. So you're going to flame me some more, scream down everybody who disagrees, and continue trying to shake $350K in a month out of thin air to sponsor somebody who hasn't finished a damn race since 2000 and dropped out last year because of handling. Knowing, surely, that you will come out of it looking like much bigger, swollen, infected assholes, but powerless to stop.

WARNING! The next paragraph contains SARCASM! Here, one last example. The same driver, same promoter last year was sponsored by Effen Vodka. And look what a great deal that was for them! Why, every corner market carries Effen Vodka now! Yes, it's all over YouTube. A real household name. Come on guys, tell me about all the Effen vodka you've drank, because of last year's glamorous Indy 500 promotion.

Yeah, good question. Why?

I'll be asking all that and more on my site tomorrow. Good night.

Apr 18, 2007
10:14 PM EST
> I'll be asking all that and more on my site tomorrow.

So basically, you are just trying to pump your site's rating, and, since helios came up with a better way to advertize Linux first, it's sour grapes too.

Apr 18, 2007
10:38 PM EST
Well Pete, I wouldn't know you from a bar of soap, but so far in all your posts and blogs you've come over as a complete dick, and that's the only impression of you I have to go on.

Apr 19, 2007
12:18 AM EST
>you've come over as a complete dick

I'm sorry, TA, but I complete disagree. I think completely dickless is more like it.

This momma's boy never moved beyond his 3 year old tantrums. Probably raised on "Yes dear, you can have it -- just please shut up!"

If things don't go his way, he is determined to make you pay.

At least he has finally come clean (so to speak). His real problem is that Helios is going ahead and doing his thing thing without genuflecting. Pp doesn't think he should do it and helios is a real poopy head for actually doing something and then challenging others to follow along.

I can only imagine the issues swirling around in that little head of his. Poor little pp. All this noise and mommy's not making it better.

Apr 19, 2007
2:47 AM EST
> that even one of you is ready to be reasonable and listen.

I may or may not be reasonable, but yes, I am not ready to listen. After what you wrote before, I'd be better off spending my time watching paint dry. You don't have anything to say that's worth listening to.

Apr 19, 2007
3:21 AM EST
Quoting:Do you know you can rent advertising space on a blimp, that fies over a whole city and doesn't need to qualify or get a pole position, for $500?

Off you go then.

Apr 19, 2007
4:37 AM EST
> ...it's a hair-brained scheme that won't show return value.

You ignore one vital point. It's voluntary hair-brained scheme. No one is being forced to support it. And whether it won't show return value or not is a personal judgment, which can easily be disputed.

> How about if somebody collecting for world hunger got turned down for a donation and started raving "Oh, well then I guess you hate little children and you're probably a racist and a bigot too!"

Standard procedure as far as I've ever been able to tell. Maybe you deal with a better class of fund raisers.

> Why THIS driver, THIS race, THIS sport, THIS way of promoting Linux...

Why not? It's what they want to do.

> So you're going to flame me some more...

If you consider this a flame, yes. That again raises the question of exactly how long you've been on the Internet though.

The only real content I was able to find in your rant was that Helios has done a good job of getting the word out, and is none too shy about calling out those who are impolite when they disagree.

Gee, ain't that a shame. He's ignoring your priceless and obviously correct opinion and doing what he think is best. How could he be so cruel and thoughtless. This must be remedied immediately and everyone must acknowledge that Penguin Pete is obviously the only person competent to be put in charge of Linux promotion world wide. Given that Red Hat, Novell, and Canonical must already have been in contact to arrange for you to run their campaigns, I'm certain that LXer will be happy to oblige now that they've been properly made aware of your importance. I'm sure that the editors are reading this thread even now and will be in touch later today.

Apr 19, 2007
4:42 AM EST
>Pretend you have a sense of humor and read this part:<

I must not have a sense of humor. I didn't find a single thing about your post funny.

Apr 19, 2007
5:00 AM EST
As helios as said many times throughout this, if you don't like this idea, and think something else would work better, do your idea. (I am paraphrasing here)

Just think of what would happen if helios did this, the champ racing support did his thing, Penguin Pete did the blimp, etc, etc. Then all the community members that think this is a hairbrained idea could contribute to one of the other ideas, and linux gets out in multiple ways. That is what will get linux out to the masses.

Those who say that this one race wont do much could be right. But from my understanding helios wants this to be a catalyst, the beginning of linux marketing, not the end all.

So if you think this idea is dumb, start one you think is good. One of the great things about the opensource community is that when someone thinks one project is doing something wrong, they can fork it, or start over from scratch, and do it the way they want. Why not with marketing. The tux500 project is one idea, where are the competing ones, if tux500 is KDE, where is gnome, XFCE, Enlighenment, etc.

Or we can just criticize those working on this project, call them crooks, and not bring freedom to the average joe.

Apr 19, 2007
5:02 AM EST
>You ignore one vital point. It's voluntary hair-brained scheme. No one is being forced to support it.

That you for reiterating the point.

I think that's one of its strong points. If you get right down to it, RMS had a completely hare-brained scheme when he decide to create a free operating system. Face it, just about any of the naysayers in this conversation, faced with the proposition, would say "No - there are better uses for your time."

And it was idiotic, and he couldn't make a completely free operating system.

Turns out, however, that he didn't have to. The things that he did were plenty good enough. He made tools, he made waves, and, more than anything, he encouraged others to join him in his idiotic dream.

That dream doesn't look so idiotic these days, does it?

If there is a beauty to the Indy car idea, it's that we can do more than something, it's that we can do damned near anything if we set our minds to it.

FLOSS has been an evolutionary process. Lots of people, lots of projects. Most of them haven't panned out. And yet -- here I sit, typing into my free browser running on my free operating system having recorded video on my free pvr and edited it with my free editor. I can do so damned much it nearly overwhelms me.

Pretty idiotic, I guess.


Apr 19, 2007
5:22 AM EST
You guys are much too nice

You know the saying..."Don't feed the trolls"

Especially in this case, where the person(?) is trying to feed himself by being a troll.

I suppose it doesn't hurt to explain it for someone else, though.

Apr 19, 2007
6:13 AM EST
bigg -

You're right, of course. But, being a little slow, it only just occurred to me that hare-brainedness is actually one of the project's charms. It certainly is the one that would get reporters to drop a few lines about it.

Apr 19, 2007
7:46 AM EST
Quoting:helios introduces himself as "Ken Starks"
What is this world coming to? Next thing you know, tuxchick will be trying to pass herself off as "Carla Schroder".

Apr 19, 2007
7:49 AM EST
bigg, it's safe to snark at the troll here since it doesn't send him any clicks.

Dammit SFN, that was a big secret. Now I'll have to tell my roomie, Pamela Jones, to find somewhere else to live since you blabbed!!

Apr 19, 2007
8:00 AM EST
Wait a min....


[higher-pitched voice]Wait a minute. I'M Pamela Jones![/higher-pitched voice]

Apr 19, 2007
8:10 AM EST
So am I supposed to be the alter-ego of helios or devnet? :)


Apr 19, 2007
8:59 AM EST
[quoet]What is this world coming to? Next thing you know, tuxchick will be trying to pass herself off as "Carla Schroder".[/quote]

Yeah, or me as... eh... uhm.... wait...


Apr 19, 2007
9:22 AM EST
Well, the next thing you know he'll figure out that jdixon is actually James Dixon, and that he lives in WV. Amazing what you can find out on the net, isn't it?

Apr 19, 2007
9:34 AM EST
> helios introduces himself as "Ken Starks"

So, Ken 'discloses' his identity, while Penguin_Pete continues to hide behind his Penguin Pete nomer. My understanding is that he's holed up with the gophers somewhere in Iowa, but that could be misinformation too.

It's strange that Pete seems to have a rather pedestrian history of generic articles and help pieces on (when did a user not tout his Distro?) Linux. Suddenly decides he's going to be the defender of the masses of 'poor dumb' Linux users? The whole thing reeks of deceit.

So Penguin_Pete, these are the answers people really need to clear up. Does Pete really run Linux at all, Has Pete has been reading too many superman comics? Was he recently consigned to a mental facility? Is he getting something from the help MS fund? And, is Penguin_Pete a real person at all?

I know and trust Ken's credentials, but, Penguin_Pete? Not so much...

Apr 19, 2007
10:32 AM EST
There was a story on http://www.linux.org this morning that says his name is Pete Trbovich. A quick Google search reveals that he is a graphics designer in Des Moines, IA.

Not that it makes much difference, mind you, but in case you bump into him at a Vista conference, you've been warned. Or if he moves into your neighborhood, you have his information, the same as if he were a RSO. (I didn't see him in the RSO list.)

Apr 19, 2007
10:44 AM EST
Oh sheesh ...

Now I'll have to lie when people ask where I'm from ... "Iowa? Never been there. Nope, that wasn't me you knew from high school in Cedar Rapids."

Apr 19, 2007
12:20 PM EST
Funny thing is, penguins don't have them.

Apr 19, 2007
12:31 PM EST

I'm not seeing that article or anything relating to it on that site. I just love the way things disappear ;-)

Apr 19, 2007
12:34 PM EST
OK, I get the connection.

-Ubuntu is the most contributing distro in the tux500 campaign,

-Pete Trbovich a.k.a. PenguinPete doesn't like Ubuntu nor Linux, he wants us to use ReactOS. He doesn't want Linux to become mainstream, while Helios a.k.a. Ken Starks tries to make Linux the O.S. that dominates the world.


Quoting:According to Penguin Pete... ...Linux is not and never will be an operating system designed to suit disillusioned Windows users. They reckon Linux was designed to be a replacement for Unix not Windows.

So where should disaffected Windows users go? Why to an open source Windows replacement project called ReactOS of course.

My suggestion to you, Mr. Trbovich: Collect $500 in the ReactOS community, and rent advertising space on a blimp which flies the whole city. You might as well ask VituaNova and RMS to donate $500 as well, to make that three planes. If you do that, LXer would be very happy to report about it.

Probably, your problem is that Linux users are not as elitist as you are.

Quoting:Trbovich has a great writing style and the logic of his argument does appear consistent. It is also unashamedly elitist. Acording to Penguin Pete, Ubuntu is not really Linux but a cultural cringe to refugees from Windows.

Well, if Windows refugees go to Ubuntu, then use ReactOS, OpenBSD, Inferno or HURD instead. Run an ad campaign for OpenBSD. Theo de Raadt will be very pleased, especially because OpenBSD seriously lacks money. Work (code) on HURD, since it is rather unusable at this time. I say this, especially since you are wasting your time by tracking Helios and Devnet all over the internet and writing blogs about it. I understand you have time to much on your hands since you are retired, but someone with your skills can use that time in a far better way. Why not try to be useful to the ReactOS community, and make ReactOS better than Linux? Why not try to convert people from Windows and Linux to ReactOS? Why don't you set up a ReactOS lab at a school, the same way Ken (helios) set up a Linux lab at a school? Why don't spend your time covnerting the elderly to ReactOS?


Quoting:Hate the Linux command-line? ReactOS boots into a GUI and a GUI is all you get. Coming to Linux and complaining about the command line is like vacationing in Las Vegas and complaining about the casinos. ReactOS is what you want, if you insist on an exact Windows clone.

Really, ReactOS looks interesting to me. I want to make a deal with you. I'll write an honest review about ReactOS which will be published on LXer, but only if you stop saying LXer (which includes me) is helping fraud, stop posting negative blogs about Tux500, if you are polite to Ken and Devnet from now on (you are blaming them for not being polite to Linux users, while at the same time calling them @$$H0LE$, which makes _you_ seem unpolite). Could we try that? I promise the ReactOS review will be finished in the weekend of the Indy500.

BTW, when was the last time you have donated to OpenBSD or FSF?

Best, Hans Kwint LXer editor (in case you didn't know)

Apr 19, 2007
12:45 PM EST
Ok, a quick google on the name Pete Trbovich links him with both Penguin Pete and Des Moines IA.

>Well, if Windows refugees go to Ubuntu, then use OpenBSD, Inferno or HURD instead.

My own thought is that he's just an elitist. I could be mistaken, but, Pete strikes me as the ideal HURD follower.

Apr 19, 2007
12:47 PM EST
Sorry Jim, but I changed my reaction above yours after you posted. Please change 'HURD' in ReactOS.

Apr 19, 2007
12:48 PM EST
By the way, Pete has posted a handful of stories on LXer. All of them point back to his blog.

Apr 19, 2007
12:50 PM EST
Yeah, (some) people go to Pete's blog because of LXer.

Please, Mr. Trbovich: If you think helios and devnet are doing a bad job for Linux because of not being polite, realize what a terrible job you are doing for the ReactOS community. I think they're not pleased with your behaviour.

(Here's what Mr. Trbovich wrote:)
Quoting:And now the ironic part: ReactOS is starved for help! As many users out there as there are clamoring for a free Windows, you'd think this development effort would be skyrocketing. Here's a whole page on how you can contribute to this effort. You don't need to be a programmer. They need everything from beta-testers to document writers; they need to finish this audit, and they need MONEY.

(Source: http://penguinpetes.com/b2evo/index.php?title=reactos_auditi... again)

Then why complain if people think all Linux marketing needs is MONEY?

Apr 19, 2007
12:57 PM EST
> Please change 'HURD' in ReactOS.

Naw, he wants noobs to use the ReactOS... He's staying with the 'good stuff'. As I said, a self perceived elitist.

Apr 19, 2007
1:10 PM EST
Quoting:Pete Trbovich

Pitr Dubovich?? (http://www.userfriendly.org/cartoons/pitr/)

Apr 21, 2007
4:42 AM EST
Ha! I finally got my paypal account password reset :-) My donation is in (under Debian ofcourse). And just to piss off Penguin Pete I've made it 10 times the buck-a-fifty Helios asked for.

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