Is it because the Yanks don't like the French?
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| Author | Content |
|---|---|
| tracyanne Dec 16, 2009 11:39 PM EDT |
Doesn't seem to matter what the context, but Mandrake/Mandriva hardly ever gets a mention in the American Linux magazines or blogs. |
| azerthoth Dec 16, 2009 11:56 PM EDT |
yeah, that must be it ... ya got us. |
| montezuma Dec 17, 2009 12:20 AM EDT |
Nah Ubuntu completely blotted out Mandriva's niche... |
| hkwint Dec 17, 2009 5:00 AM EDT |
SJVN is surely ill, which can be seen from the fact that OpenSuse is not mentioned either. In earlier articles he stated 'some version' of Suse meant the break-through of Linux. |
| chalbersma Dec 17, 2009 7:46 AM EDT |
It's not that we don't like the French, we just wish they would come out with a better Linux Distro. |
| jdixon Dec 17, 2009 3:04 PM EDT |
In SJVN's case, he's charting the history of Linux and what he considers its groundbreaking distros. When Mandrake started, it was simply Red Hat with KDE. When SuSE started, it was Slackware with rpm's. Neither broke significant new ground in their initial form. Now, I'd argue that what Mandrake became later did break new ground, and far more so than Caldera, but that's a very subjective matter. I could also argue that there's a place for Corel Linux in that list and possibly Mepis. |
| gus3 Dec 17, 2009 4:09 PM EDT |
Quoting:When Mandrake started, it was simply Red Hat with KDE.And built for Pentium-class CPU's, rather than 386's. |
| jdixon Dec 17, 2009 4:58 PM EDT |
> And built for Pentium-class CPU's, rather than 386's. True. I stand corrected. |
| caitlyn Dec 17, 2009 6:18 PM EDT |
I don't think that most Americans hate the French. There was negative reaction to the lack of support for the invasion of Iraq but that has mostly faded. The French, as it turns out, had it right all along. I also think the French were very happy the greasy potato things so many Americans eat weren't called French fries for a time. I probably would have had Red Hat 1.0 on the list rather than EL 2 but that's just me. I actually do agree with him about Caldera. They were also first with a graphical installer. Mandrake? I agree that it wasn't groundbreaking. Popular? Yes. Well done? Absolutely. Groundbreaking? Not really. Others I'd add: Knoppix -- not the first live CD but rather the distro which popularized the live CD. Damn Small Linux -- first at tiny and functional, which resulted in a whole new generation of mini and micro distros. Yggdrasil -- first distro. Sure, it never became popular, but it sure started a trend, didn't it? |
| jdixon Dec 17, 2009 9:32 PM EDT |
> I also think the French were very happy the greasy potato things so many Americans eat weren't called French fries for a time. I've always assumed they're called french fries because of the cut of the potato. Like french cut green beans. |
| Sander_Marechal Dec 17, 2009 10:15 PM EDT |
jdixon, that's my understanding as well. In the Netherlands and Belguim there are many kinds of fries. We refer to french fries as the really thinly cut fries (something like 0.5x0.5 cm). Dutch fries are bigger (up to 1x1 cm) and Flemmish fries are even bigger still (and irregularly cut). IIRC english fries are more like sliced potatoe. And then there's "raspatat". It's made from squeezing mashed potatoes through small round holes, then fry the strands of mashed potatoe. |
| dinotrac Dec 17, 2009 10:54 PM EDT |
Sander - Dutch people have no right to discuss fries, preferring mayonnaise-y stuff over ketchup, which is how God himself would eat fries if he bothered with such things. |
| montezuma Dec 17, 2009 11:36 PM EDT |
Sander, The English would hang and quarter you for discussing "english fries". They are chips. |
| beirwin Dec 18, 2009 2:04 AM EDT |
Then of course there is also Poutine (French fries covered with cheese curd and topped with brown gravy), which originated in rural Quebec in the late 1950's, and now can be found across Canada in various fast-food chains. For the curious here is a picture: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Poutine.JPG . Doesn't turn my crank! |
| gus3 Dec 18, 2009 2:46 AM EDT |
Can't be worse than chili-cheese-tots! My favorite Wednesday dish in the factory canteen, even when it wasn't on the menu. After enough people saw me ordering it, and ordered the same thing, the caterers made it an official main course. |
| Sander_Marechal Dec 18, 2009 3:59 AM EDT |
Quoting:Dutch people have no right to discuss fries, preferring mayonnaise-y stuff over ketchup Ever been to a Dutch fries shop? They have more kinds of sauce than you can shake a stick at. |
| DiBosco Dec 18, 2009 6:02 AM EDT |
Heh, we went to the chips/French Fries/frietjes museum in Bruges this year. IIRC the term comes from American soldiers seeing Belgian soldiers eating chips (sorry, I can't bring myself to call them fries) and thinking they were French [soldiers]. Anyway, we had chips at the museum and they were rubbish. (I do like continental Europe style chips but these were just poor.) I'm not sure I'd _quite_ agree with Sander's description of British chips, they are just like sort you get anywhere else except bigger. They're the same shape, just (a fair deal) fatter and (usually) shorter. Yes, they are slices of potato, but surely most chips are? Oh, and we put salt and vinegar over our chips. My [Dutch] wife thinks I ruin my them putting vinegar on! When our chips are made well I think they're really good, more substance than those from McDonald's and European style chips which can tend to be all crispy skin and nothing else, but if they're not made right than can be soggy and awful. |
| dinotrac Dec 18, 2009 8:15 PM EDT |
Sander - Yes. In my younger days, I worked for a while in Rotterdam. |
| jacog Dec 20, 2009 1:47 PM EDT |
But Rotterdam could be anywhere. |
| tuxchick Dec 20, 2009 3:37 PM EDT |
So this is what LXer has become...long discussions of fried potatoes. |
| tuxchick Dec 20, 2009 3:58 PM EDT |
Anyway, fried spuds are bland without some help. It is absolutely required that they be accompanied by fried onions. Slice onions to make thin rings. Heat frying pan to medium heat, throw in a bit of canola oil, and saute onions until they are nicely carmelized and translucent. Fling together with fried spuds and eat with gusto. That's good grub! And remember, sharp knives are safe knives. Keep a good edge on your knives with this handy sharpener: http://www.chefknivestogo.com/wusthof-knife-life-sharpener.h... Nice and easy, it holds the blade at the correct angle and puts on a nice edge. I have restored many a dull blade with this little gadget. It takes skill with a whetstone to do better. |
| caitlyn Dec 20, 2009 4:02 PM EDT |
I think fried potatoes can stand alone without fried onions, as much as I like fried onions. I will also say that I am a heretic when it comes to fries. My favorite things to add to them: 1) Salt and pepper: no sauce, mayo, ketchup, mustard, or anything else gloppy 2) Horseradish sauce, a fairly hot one: if you have to have glop it should be spicy glop Oh, and yes, tuxchick, I freely admit to contributing to the lowered LXer.com standards. Would you like fries with that? |
| tuxchick Dec 20, 2009 4:05 PM EDT |
Yes caitlyn, with fried onions and plenty of spicy glop. And beer. And make it snappy! |
| caitlyn Dec 20, 2009 4:06 PM EDT |
OK, if you provide the plane ticket (round trip) between North Carolina and your part of Oregon :) Oh, and you'll have to find a ferret sitter too since most airlines won't allow ferrets in the cabin. That, or send your private jet. |
| tuxchick Dec 20, 2009 4:25 PM EDT |
Ya iknow, Scott really needs to get off his duff and fire up the official LXer Party Jet. Fly around, pick us up, and feed and amuse us. |
| caitlyn Dec 20, 2009 4:56 PM EDT |
Sounds good to me. Maybe we can all have the jet pick us up and take us to a nice ski resort with plenty of snow. Colorado is between you and me and would do nicely. So long as Scott permits ferrets in the cabin (in a carrier, of course) and has really nice pet friendly accommodations this could work out well. My family doesn't celebrate Christmas and I have next Thursday and Friday off, so... does Christmas (or Festivus) in Vail or Aspen or some other such place sound good? I'll even volunteer to buy the potatoes and onions for frying since Scott is being so nice by providing the jet. |
| Sander_Marechal Dec 20, 2009 5:00 PM EDT |
Ah, the party jet! Yes, it's about time it's put to good use. As for fries, if I don't eat them with mayonaise I like them "special" (mayonaise, onions and red tomato curry), with sate sauce or with "hachee". No idea what hachee is in English but it's some sort of beef stew. |
| hkwint Dec 20, 2009 5:09 PM EDT |
Well, it's funny. I had typed some comment about how much American and French people were the same if you'd enforce LXer TOS upon them (no discussion about religion & politics). It was a comment which actually made some sense given the topic. However, that's when I started to think of more differences between the French and American people, and then I thought of the diet and deleted my comment, thinking it could only degenerate the thread to be about food, yet again. Seems you - my dear commenters - don't even need me to degenerate threads into food-talk! And the funny thing is - the only place where you can buy French potatoes in Belgium, is in the American restaurants. Reminds me of how a 'Wiener' is called a Wiener all over the world except in Vienna, where it's called a Frankfurter. Anyway, back on topic: I suggest a poll. Where all Americans may indicate whether they hate the French or not. SJVN is the first one invited. So now, given all the snow outside - let's start about talking about BBQ again. That's just what I need considerinrg it's not sure if I'm going to reach 'work' tomorrow because of a lousy 10cm of snow outisde. Ah yes, I smell charcoal, and I almost see the sun! |
| caitlyn Dec 20, 2009 5:10 PM EDT |
@Sander: Your "special" version sounds good. I don't eat beef so I'll pass on the hachee. I do make an awesome vegetarian cholent if anyone is interested. See: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cholent There is an annual National Cholent Competition in Jerusalem every year. All sorts of interesting recipes have turned up, including vegetarian ones and ones substituting fish or other meats for the traditional beef (Ashkenazi recipes) or chicken (Sephardi recipes). OK, now I'm getting hungry. See what y'all did? |
| caitlyn Dec 20, 2009 5:12 PM EDT |
@hkwint: Hans, I'm American but my mother was born in Paris. I'd have to be pretty much self-hating to hate the French. |
| tuxchick Dec 20, 2009 6:47 PM EDT |
And what's wrong with food, my dear Hans? ;) Hating the French is silly. I live in redneckland, and I am thoroughly tired of dumb stuff like Patriot Fries and surrender jokes. France has been an awesome friend to the US all throughout our history, and the French people persisted heroically in WWII despite years of occupation by the Nazis, and losing something like a third of their men and boys in war. I daresay many of our heroic patriotic flag-waving surrender-joking Americans would not last five minutes under those conditions. |
| jdixon Dec 20, 2009 6:54 PM EDT |
> ...long discussions of fried potatoes. You would rather have us discussing fried rice? > It is absolutely required that they be accompanied by fried onions. Well, any scallion will do in an emergency. Around here the preferred variety is ramps. > Reminds me of how a 'Wiener' is called a Wiener all over the world except in Vienna, where it's called a Frankfurter. Actually, they're usually called hot dogs around here, |
| dinotrac Dec 20, 2009 6:56 PM EDT |
It is silly to hate the French.
They can't help themselves. Johnny Hallyday? At least he's recovering. |
| tuxchick Dec 20, 2009 7:30 PM EDT |
Scallions are good in rice, too. |
| caitlyn Dec 20, 2009 7:41 PM EDT |
Fried rice with scallions... Yum. |
| tracyanne Dec 20, 2009 9:55 PM EDT |
I was living in Auckland when the French Secret Service sank the Rainbow Warrior in Auckland Harbour. Actually while she was tied up at the wharf.a Dutch Photographer, a member of the crew, was asleep in his bunk at the time, was drowned. |
| Koriel Dec 21, 2009 2:10 AM EDT |
Im from Aberdeen, Scotland but live in Southern Vermont now and I really miss my chip suppers as we call them. A supper is a term for just about any single food item (usually deep fried, just to make sure its dead) with a generous portion of chips with some classy condiments (salt & vinegar) I usually had the red pudding supper which is delicious but sometimes treated myself to a macaroni pie supper or deep fried bananna supper, yummy, all washed down with a large bottle of Irn Bru. Please consult a doctor before trying these delicacys dont blame me if your drop dead of clogged arteries and heart failure :) Only Scots can withstand this sort of biological abuse. |
| gus3 Dec 21, 2009 2:53 AM EDT |
Then I must be a Scot, because my mother (confirmed Scot) enjoyed stopping at a local greasy spoon after school, to have exactly that (chips+salt&vinegar). In fact, she told me and my dad (another confirmed Scot) about it just this evening, when I brought up this thread. |
| chalbersma Dec 21, 2009 5:13 AM EDT |
Fries are best ate one way, with Lawry's Seasoned Salt. No ketchup, mustard mayo or any of that bullsniky. |
| Sander_Marechal Dec 21, 2009 7:25 AM EDT |
Quoting:@Sander: Your "special" version sounds good. I don't eat beef so I'll pass on the hachee. I do make an awesome vegetarian cholent if anyone is interested. Yes, very interested! My girlfriend is vegetarian too (not by choice, but on docter's orders) so I'm always on the lookout for nice vegetarian recipes. Please consider posting the recipe here, or PM it to me. Quoting:Reminds me of how a 'Wiener' is called a Wiener all over the world except in Vienna, where it's called a Frankfurter. Haha. That reminds me of Dutch names for types of beer glasses. There's a slightly larger glass that everyone calls an "Amsterdammer", except in Amsterdam where they are called "vaasje" (vase). Quoting:A supper is a term for just about any single food item (usually deep fried, just to make sure its dead) with a generous portion of chips with some classy condiments (salt & vinegar) I'm not keep on salt & vinegar on my hot chips or fries. But I love salt & vinegar flavoured potato chips from the supermaket. Sadly they don't sell them in the Netherlands so I either import them from France or I get them at a speciality British supermarket. |
| jacog Dec 21, 2009 7:54 AM EDT |
And I believe in the Netherlands you guys eat cake-sprinkles on sandwiches. I tried it, and it's just weird... or maybe our friends there were playing a trick on us. |
| hkwint Dec 21, 2009 8:09 AM EDT |
We don't know cake-sprinkles, what the # is that? Something you put on cake and pies? Why would somebody do that? Hagelslag on the other hand, yes, even in at least five different flavours and different shapes. My sister can't live without it, and freaked out when we were out of chocolate sprinkles in Athens. So on the last day of our holiday she went out to buy another 100gr for $3,5 (in our country it's 400gr for $1). And the Brittish BTW don't care about mayonaise, ketchup or vinegar, they just use an old 'newspaper' instead. Tastes much better, and has a better 'educational' nutritional value. |
| jacog Dec 21, 2009 8:32 AM EDT |
Yeah, same stuff, except here it only goes on cakes/cupcakes etc, never on bread. :) I still have some at home actually, now that I think of it. |
| Sander_Marechal Dec 21, 2009 3:22 PM EDT |
Quoting:We don't know cake-sprinkles, what the # is that? Yes we do. Stuff like "hagelslag", "vruchtenhagel" and "chocloade vlokken" that we put on bread, they put that on cakes instead. |
| caitlyn Dec 21, 2009 4:17 PM EDT |
...or on ice cream. They are also called "jimmies" in some parts of the States. |
| jsusanka Dec 21, 2009 10:25 PM EDT |
"Doesn't seem to matter what the context, but Mandrake/Mandriva hardly ever gets a mention in the American Linux magazines or blogs." I have to totally agree. Mandrake should replace caldera in this list. I first used slackware then I bought mandrake at sams club and I was in heaven. It was the best distro ever and the first one that was easier to install than windows. on another note is what I want to know is why have the book stores and sams club stop selling distros like mandrake? I remember you could buy a box set in the bookstores of mandrake and I wish those days were back. But I guess the internet tubes killed that off and you could just download them today. Why do I always answer my own questions? I drive my wife nuts doing that. LOL. |
| hkwint Dec 22, 2009 3:36 AM EDT |
I wasn't serious Sander... But not good at being sarcastic I see. Anyway, I saw a friend of mine using Mandrake in 2003 or so, about when I started with Gentoo. He wasn't a geek or anything, but he found it as easy to use as WinXP in '03, so to me it seems Mandrake was the first distribution 'approachable for non-geeks'. But when you only have five shots you have to choose. It would be easier if you said 'the 15 distro's that changed Linux' I guess. |
| DiBosco Dec 22, 2009 5:40 AM EDT |
@Koriel, we had to laugh one year when we went up to Scotland for a few days. We went into the chippy and asked for fish and chips. They pretended not to understand us until we asked for a fish supper! |
| montezuma Dec 22, 2009 9:25 AM EDT |
That reminds me of a "restaurant" I went into in SW England. The menu consisted of I would estimate 80 item all of which said "and chips". I managed to evince an extremely dirty look from the waiter by being a smartarse and asking if they had anything without chips. |
| caitlyn Dec 22, 2009 11:13 AM EDT |
Sander: let me look up some online Jewish recipe sites and some which have the recipes for award winning cholent and I'll post some links. I'll add some notes about what I like to do :) Give me a day or two, OK? |
| Koriel Dec 22, 2009 5:36 PM EDT |
As far a Mandriva goes, I tried the 2010 free edition about a fortnight ago, it was OK but nothing special, it certainly didnt make me want to change over from my PCLinuxOS on the desktop and Slackware on the server combo.
I used to use Mandrake in its early days but from about version 9 onwards I feel they lost their way especially in the area of quality control and the only thing that was keeping me on Mandrake was Texstars patronage as soon as he decided to do his own distro (PCLinuxOS) it was just a question of time before I moved away from Mandrake. As jdixon said, that later "Mandrake did break new ground" but I feel that period was fairly short lived, their are now a lot better distro's out there and that they are now just one of many. As for not liking the French im all for them, but they can keep those d@mn snails, i'll stick with my red pudding suppers! Edit: A quick google turned up my fav delicacy here http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Red_pudding Or the Macaroni pie supper http://mytabularassa.blogspot.com/2009/09/maccaroni-pie.html Never mind the looks it all tastes great especially after 10 pints of Tennents, http://www.beerstore.com.au/beerstore/uploads/beerImages/Ten... |
| DiBosco Dec 22, 2009 7:33 PM EDT |
Mandriva's best release, IMHO, was 2008.1. I still use it on my main machine, but KDE4 is just about good enough to use as a main workhorse now and I'm actually using 2010 as much as 2008.1. As far as I could make out when I had a play with it, PCLinuxOS _is_ Mandriva just with a different package manager. All in all, I still think it [Mandriva] is a cracking distribution and the control centre is a real stand out feature. I've had a play with a couple of other distributions like Debian, but always come back to Mandriva. Hurrah for the choice you get with Linux. :~) |
| Sander_Marechal Dec 23, 2009 3:58 AM EDT |
@Caitlyn: That would be great, thanks. @Koriel: The description of that "red pudding" vaguely reminds me of what the Dutch call a "viandel". |
| dinotrac Dec 23, 2009 9:39 AM EDT |
I call TOS. My God! We are deep in a discussion of Dutch and Scot food. What next? French baseball? The horror. |
| Sander_Marechal Dec 23, 2009 11:04 AM EDT |
I agree dino. I call TOS too. *Some* people in here are trying to derail a perfectly good thread on food by interspersing comments on Mandriva. ;-) |
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