Their inventions:
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| Author | Content |
|---|---|
| amadensor Sep 01, 2010 3:36 PM EDT |
I am not so sure about FAT. I have not looked into it. How does it differ from the CBM disk layout? The CBM layout was linked sectors, each sector pointed to the sector that followed it in its header. In addition, there was a file allocation table to show what disk was used versus free. As for their actual inventions: MS Bob. No one bought it. No one wanted it. They stuffed it down our throats with Clippit in MS Word, which was so bad that they called it a feature when they finally removed it. |
| phsolide Sep 01, 2010 6:33 PM EDT |
At the time (late 70s, early 80s) a disk-based filesystem wasn't a new technology. Lots of disk-based filesystems existed. Floppy-disk optimized filesystems existed. MSFT may have a patent on FAT filesystems, but if they do, they don't deserve it. It wasn't at all an innovation. It was an imitation. This topic has been hashed and rehashed. I'd be surprised if anyone could come up with anything other than "a distinctive combination of software offerings, marketed coherently". MS-DOS was a C/PM knockoff, pretty obviously. Why did MSFT settle with Gary Killdall if it wasn't? Spreadsheets? Visicalc and Lotus 1-2-3 came first. Word processors? Invented in antiquity, practically. Operating systems? Old hat. Remote procedure calls? MSFT bought theirs from OSF. While I'm sure that some invention has gone on at MSFT, it's of the trivial variety. MSFT has *never* been the innovator, always a follower. Let's not revise history to reflect otherwise, OK? |
| hkwint Sep 01, 2010 7:39 PM EDT |
Seems they invented some stuff which was in Direct3D, and only ended up in OpenGL several years later, due to the latter being such a conservative bunch of people. |
| d0nk3y Sep 01, 2010 8:28 PM EDT |
Re: Clippy - fyi At the teched I just attended, they were giving away tee-shirts with the slogan "Bring Back Clippy!" So, now it's gone from bad throat stuffing, to removed 'feature' to (attempted) cult hero. |
| jdixon Sep 01, 2010 9:13 PM EDT |
> "Bring Back Clippy!" Done: http://vigor.sourceforge.net/ |
| gus3 Sep 01, 2010 9:36 PM EDT |
Here's Vigor's inspirational story line: http://www.userfriendly.org/cartoons/archives/00jan/20000104... |
| tuxchick Sep 02, 2010 12:22 AM EDT |
MS didn't even invent looting and rapine, they copied that too. |
| jezuch Sep 02, 2010 2:30 AM EDT |
Remember the (in)famous "Open Letter to Hobbyists" by Bill Gates? It was a pioneering work! |
| hkwint Sep 02, 2010 5:23 AM EDT |
Finally, after a night sleep, here's what I could come up with: Microsoft invented the manager bouncing on stage, a billionaire acting in the worst ad ever, they were almost the sole creators of the A/V scene, they invented the first appstore which failed and went offline (MarketPlace it was called IIRC). They may have invented the scheme where an OEM pays for the number of computers they sell (no matter if MS software is on it or not), and not for the number of licenses they sell (that scheme is now forbidden). They also largely invented ISO-standards which don't benefit society nor the branch as a whole, and ISO-standards which duplicate another ISO-standard. They invented calling Linux a cancer, they invented large parts of HTML (the parts which were MS-only). I think they had some inventions in the 'programming language independent' field too, like ActiveX. Most of all they invented the 'buying yourself into a market where nobody wants you', such as Windows HPC. And maybe the first 'platform which was introduced and abandoned within a month', called KIN. Seems they made some inventions after all? |
| TxtEdMacs Sep 02, 2010 8:08 AM EDT |
Hans, Jealous? Well just admit that MS is both persistent* and consistent. YBT * Sometimes they succeed**, that is by corning the mass market by marketing finesse or force. That is, when the former fails. What's there not to like? ** And those few times cover all the Bills and more. |
| olefowdie Sep 02, 2010 3:21 PM EDT |
Microsoft had a lot of innovation in the realm of how to get patents you do not deserve, how to successfully identify and purchase competitors, and they did do quite a bit in the realm of 3d rendering. As a matter of fact, opengl performance is better on windows than on other OSs, and they have better 3d performance overall... i just have to wonder whether or not those 3d technologies were innovated or purchased by msft. |
| Sander_Marechal Sep 02, 2010 3:53 PM EDT |
@olefowdie: OpenGL performance is about equal on Windows and Linux. See various Phoronix benchmarks. And it's no surprise, since both platforms use essentially the same driver. A driver which has not been developed by Microsoft but by the hardware supplier. Second, OpenGL performance is irrelevant. OpenGL isn't developed by Microsoft. They have Direct3D. In fact, Microsoft has actively worked *against* OpenGL. Microsoft's OpenGL drivers are *still* at OpenGL 1.2 and they refuse to update them, so they give an unfair advantage to Direct3D. To answer your last question: They bought out RenderMorphics to get their hands on Direct3D. |
| Julie188 Sep 02, 2010 4:35 PM EDT |
Microsoft was first to market with a thing called the disk operating system ... but other than MS-DOS, Microsoft hasn't invented a thing. (And I'm sure you could document how they didn't really invent DOS either, but I'll give them that one. You can trace every idea back to another originating idea. But the MS-DOS personal computer was disruptive and sent them on their way.) Other than that, they have always waited to see what was popular, then come in with their own version, usually cheaper and poorer performing. Or sometimes they've just stolen the popular thing outright, gave it away for free, embedded in the OS and tried to put their competitor out of business. |
| skelband Sep 02, 2010 5:04 PM EDT |
julie188 - "disk operating system" I wouldn't even give them that one. What is CP/M if not, among other things, a DOS? |
| bigg Sep 02, 2010 5:14 PM EDT |
> And I'm sure you could document how they didn't really invent DOS either, but I'll give them that one. Yes, so I don't see any reason to give them credit for it. They got lucky when they made a deal with IBM. That's not an invention. |
| hkwint Sep 02, 2010 7:57 PM EDT |
Maybe we could credit them with the invention of "naked short selling of software": Selling software you don't have yet. Though I don't like the vision of Mr. Gates naked I have to confess... |
| jdixon Sep 02, 2010 8:02 PM EDT |
> I wouldn't even give them that one. Ditto. Both CP/M and TRSDOS predated MSDOS by many years. |
| gus3 Sep 02, 2010 8:37 PM EDT |
Didn't System/360 also do file ("dataset") management in its own filesystem? |
| jezuch Sep 03, 2010 2:35 AM EDT |
Quoting:"disk operating system" That name is a "beautification" of the thing they bought as "Quick and Dirty Operating System (QDOS)". |
| phsolide Sep 03, 2010 12:30 PM EDT |
"Disk Operating Systems" existed for mini-computers (PDP-11, and even it's predecessors) for many years before CP/M (the model for QDOS a.k.a. MS-DOS). IBM even had a "DOS" for one of its mainframes in the early-mid-60s. I believe "gus3" is correct about System/360. Cripes, at Northeast Missouri Statue University, in 1973 or 74, they had a Honeywell 1640 that had an operating system, and it had a single-level (no subdirectories) filesystem. The 1640 was not new in '74, either. |
| Bob_Robertson Sep 03, 2010 12:35 PM EDT |
Let's not forget that, the entire time, there was UNIX to inspire them all. I've often thought that the single-user OSs were just a shell doing all the work. The OS as a business, rather than hardware manufacturers having to write their own, already existed in CP/M and UNIX. Oh well. What Microsoft invented, or rather perfected, was Sole Source Contracts for OEMs. |
| caitlyn Sep 03, 2010 12:43 PM EDT |
Microsoft bought QDOS from Seattle Computer Products and renamed it MS-DOS. Like most of everything else Microsoft calls their own they bought it from another company or just bought the company outright. |
| gus3 Sep 03, 2010 12:55 PM EDT |
Quoting:Let's not forget that, the entire time, there was UNIX to inspire them all.I hope that was sarcasm. OS/360 was announced, together with the System/360, in 1964. TOPS-10 escaped in 1967. Multics' first release was in 1969. |
| jdixon Sep 03, 2010 1:18 PM EDT |
> Didn't System/360 also do file ("dataset") management in its own filesystem? I believe so, yes. But I don't know much about the 360, so I can't say for certain. Wikipedia could probably tell us. |
| gus3 Sep 03, 2010 1:38 PM EDT |
Here we go: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/OS/360#Shared_features |
| Bob_Robertson Sep 03, 2010 4:09 PM EDT |
> I hope that was sarcasm. No, but since I was talking about the 70s, and you aren't, we haven't contradicted each other. |
| hkwint Sep 03, 2010 7:16 PM EDT |
So apart from some features introduced in DirectX, we stitll don't know what MS invented, do we? |
| Bob_Robertson Sep 03, 2010 10:50 PM EDT |
> we stitll don't know what MS invented, do we? Everything except Bob, they imitated (Lotus => Office, iPod => Zune, Nintendo => Xbox, Lisa/Mac => Windows) or bought (Visio, QDOS, XENIX). Microsoft is really the Disney Corp of Software. With the exception of the Mouse, of course, which will never go public domain no matter how many politicians have to be bought! |
| caitlyn Sep 04, 2010 2:33 AM EDT |
Quoting:Microsoft is really the Disney Corp of Software. Nah. In Walt Disney's day both the creator and his company were very creative. When has Microsoft ever been creative? Microsoft is more like the Daleks. Microsoft conquers and destroys. They think they are the masters of the universe, or at least will be once they exterminate the competition. Exterminate! Exterminate! EXTERMINATE! |
| TxtEdMacs Sep 04, 2010 6:53 AM EDT |
Quoting:Exterminate! Exterminate! EXTERMINATE!Any reasonable person would know instinctively that is NOT MS's work motto ... it would kill the cash flow. Sure kill some, cripple others or buy then discard ..., but murder all perceived competition. No, never (unless it became an absolute necessity - but we are not there yet). So look MS's business history, hey they buy companies where some actually survive [for a time] within the greater structure. Others just have their technology copied or stolen and then die off without further intervention on MS's part. Others are ignored and feeble versions of their product are offered that with shrewed marketing pushes the superior product from the public's mind*. See how unreasonable that statement was? Murder everyone? No, it's bad business. Like loan sharking, murder is the last resort where a few broken bones or threats against family or friends more times than not suffices. Think of all the junkies they would lose in the drug trade, if the only competitive option were too kill off all perceived competition when so many times those dangers can be taken care of by other means. Smart pushers try not to kill off clientèle in a cross fire when taking new territory, hurts cash flow and gets the attention of the police**. Do you now understand how extremist statements like the one shown at the top, make all Free and to a lesser extent Open supporters being aggregated with the fringe elements society? It damages Linux's reputation, so moderate the language or we will not retain the one percent we have. Please don't associate yourself with the Commie fringe, buy MS Windows machines and quietly install Linux. Be glad that is allowed, but keep it to yourself and don't bash MS. That way we might survive. YBT * Enabled by the bought off chattering class and those thinking themselves experts with reputations, that mindlessly support the entrenched. ** Most times not, but why take the risk. |
| caitlyn Sep 04, 2010 8:50 AM EDT |
You know what Txt? You're right. They are more like the Cybermen than the Daleks. Turn everyone into Cybermen and delete those who resist. |
| gus3 Sep 04, 2010 1:34 PM EDT |
Quoting:Nah. In Walt Disney's day both the creator and his company were very creative. When has Microsoft ever been creative?Caitlyn, your posts are often thoughtful and insightful, so I'm willing to overlook this blemish on your record. The Disney empire was founded on swiping others' ideas. Even "Steamboat Willie" was a rip on "Steamboat Bill, Jr." But, given that the Hollywood movie-making culture was founded on the same, it's hardly a surprise. Edison tried to gain a monopoly on the movie industry http://arstechnica.com/tech-policy/news/2010/09/thomas-ediso... and Hollywood on the west coast tried to get away from Edison on the east coast. When Walt was alive, he did everything he could to project a family-friendly, kid-friendly image, but his business practices were nothing short of ruthless (a la Bill Gates, not Steve Ballmer). |
| Bob_Robertson Sep 06, 2010 7:32 PM EDT |
> In Walt Disney's day both the creator and his company were very creative. When has Microsoft ever been creative? Walt Disney had many faults, but a lack of imagination was not one of them. I really, really miss his fabricated nature documentaries, and he set the standard of cherry-picking the Public Domain and then treating the stories as his own. |
| hkwint Sep 06, 2010 8:01 PM EDT |
So the conclusion is Bill Gates created the same amount of movies as the amount of software Walt Disney wrote? |
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