LibreOffice: OpenOffice.org Liberated
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| Author | Content |
|---|---|
| henke54 Sep 28, 2010 5:06 AM EDT |
more info here : http://user.services.openoffice.org/en/forum/viewtopic.php?f... |
| r_a_trip Sep 28, 2010 5:38 AM EDT |
Openoffice.org is dead! Long live LibreOffice! I'm a bit shocked to see a fork emerging this quickly, but then again, we have all seen the razor sharp teeth of Oracle gleam after the Sun set. count me as a LibreOffice user. I just hope that their aren't any fundamental patents in Oracle's arsenal that could derail the new effort with a lawsuit. |
| twickline Sep 28, 2010 5:51 AM EDT |
Everything from Sun that Oracle has touched has went to the dogs... We now have LibreOffice and OpenIndiana all we need now is Open VirtualBox.. Then im 100% Oracle free! |
| JaseP Sep 28, 2010 9:45 AM EDT |
It's a good thing it's forking, as it gives everyone a sigh of relief, & a place to run if a fire-storm breaks out. It's clear that Oracle doesn't quite get Open Source, in concept. But I think it's premature to say that Oracle will kill OpenOffice.org (or even try to). But I bet they will try to leverage it somehow... (cross-patent deal and defacto office productivity standard for a certain embeded Linux-based OS,.. Maybe?!?!?) |
| Bob_Robertson Sep 28, 2010 10:12 AM EDT |
Interesting Times, indeed. Let's hope that Oracle plays nice and releases the brand. I'm not holding my breath. |
| mark_oz Sep 28, 2010 10:14 AM EDT |
> I just hope that their aren't any fundamental patents in Oracle's arsenal that could derail the new effort with a lawsuit. OpenOffice was licensed under the LGPL_v3 license. http://www.openoffice.org/license.html The LGPL_v3 license includes a patent grant. Oracle therefore cannot sue users of LibreOffice since said users already have a patent grant for use of the OpenOffice code base. This is just one of the many reasons for people to choose to use GPL_v3 / LGPL_v3 software whenever they can. |
| Sander_Marechal Sep 28, 2010 10:42 AM EDT |
I'm enthusiastic. But they could have picked a better name than "The Document Foundation". |
| TxtEdMacs Sep 28, 2010 10:49 AM EDT |
Read All About It*: Bob Robertson is holding his breath until Oracle Plays Nice. Weather Prediction: Chronic Fainting Spells Ahead. YBT * Fact Checking be d@mned, we do not easily become confused by such refuse when a good story is at hand. We are only using the highest journalistic standards that are currently employed by the majors. Therefore, made up is more news worthy. |
| r_a_trip Sep 28, 2010 11:04 AM EDT |
OpenOffice was licensed under the LGPL_v3 license. Thanks for the info, mark_oz. I wasn't aware of the license upgrade. (Goes to show that practically no user reads all the legalese). But LGPL V3 has indeed licensed all required patents for use and modification. Thank you Sun for making this possible. LibreOffice FTW. |
| caitlyn Sep 28, 2010 11:43 AM EDT |
My only concern is that dropping the proprietary addons and plugins may mean reduced document compatibility, not so much with MS Office but rather with some of the legacy office products. Those proprietary bits may be absolutely necessary for retrieving archival documents in some places. I also don't share the enthusiasm for forks. I hold out little hope that Oracle employed OpenOffice people will collaborate with LibreOffice. We'll end up with more products but maybe not better products. Free for the sake of making RMS and those who share his hardcore definition of free happy is not a good thing in my book. Having said all of that, I trust Oracle about as far as I can throw their corporate headquarters. This probably had to happen at some point. I'm just not sure we had reached that point yet. |
| smallboxadmin Sep 28, 2010 12:22 PM EDT |
I had a hard enough time getting customers (actually the customers were fine, it's the darn end users) to switch from MS Office to OpenOffice. If OOo dies and I'm forced to switch to LibreOffice (hate the name by the way) I could just give in and make them buy MS Office licenses. Customers like stability (Ironic isn't it?) even if it's only in name and "brand". |
| Scott_Ruecker Sep 28, 2010 2:38 PM EDT |
From what the article said the immediate beta will be based on Go-oo that has been collecting all the fixes Sun would not approve. From the looks of it Caitlyn it seems like it should work with legacy stuff as good as OO.o or better. |
| ComputerBob Sep 28, 2010 3:03 PM EDT |
Nacho LibreOffice: The Jack Black Edition |
| gus3 Sep 28, 2010 3:08 PM EDT |
@Scott: "From the looks of Caitlyn"? Not complaining here, but what does that have to do with it? Or, are you saying Caitlyn has taken a few looks at it? Tee hee. Do you really think I would let that one slide? @caitlyn: The great tidbit of advice I got from Jimmy Wales' presentation at TED is, "If you're going to fail, fail early [rather than later]." It's probably better to get the code and fork it now, when it's convenient, rather than later, when it's immediately imperative. |
| Scott_Ruecker Sep 28, 2010 3:10 PM EDT |
From the looks of it.. dork. ;-) |
| jdixon Sep 28, 2010 4:57 PM EDT |
> This probably had to happen at some point. I'm just not sure we had reached that point yet. Caitlyn, given your heritage, I'd think you'd see the wisdom in dealing with potential aggressors/menaces sooner rather than later. |
| Bob_Robertson Sep 28, 2010 5:01 PM EDT |
> given your heritage... Heck, given HISTORY! |
| hkwint Sep 28, 2010 6:09 PM EDT |
Lots of developers were already fed up with OpenOffice when it was still managed by Sun. From what I understood, the organization is really bureaucratic and slow, and if you contribute, copyright goes to Sun. |
| Bob_Robertson Sep 28, 2010 7:22 PM EDT |
> and if you contribute, copyright goes to Sun. In the immortal words of Inspector Cleuseu, "Not anymore." |
| caitlyn Sep 28, 2010 9:00 PM EDT |
I'm not offended by any of the comments. My heritage and my history both apply. I don't think anyone can judge anything about an office suite from my looks :) OK, I am bothered by one comment: It's Inspector Clouseau, not whatever Bob typed. |
| Bob_Robertson Sep 28, 2010 9:13 PM EDT |
sew, speeling es knot mie stroung suite. |
| caitlyn Sep 28, 2010 9:17 PM EDT |
Swine Bob! See: http://www.inspectorclouseau.com/rulesofspeech.html rule #5. |
| gus3 Sep 28, 2010 9:35 PM EDT |
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SXn2QVipK2o Classic Clouseau. |
| Bob_Robertson Sep 29, 2010 9:09 AM EDT |
> Classic Clouseau. Without even looking at it, my first thought was, "Does your dog bite?" |
| ComputerBob Sep 29, 2010 9:42 AM EDT |
That is not my dog. |
| henke54 Sep 29, 2010 10:48 AM EDT |
translate from Dutch dev OOo mailinglist :
Quoting:No, that's not the case. Oracle is emphatically invited to participate in the independent foundation.http://nl.openoffice.org/servlets/ReadMsg?list=discussie&msg... |
| caitlyn Sep 29, 2010 11:37 AM EDT |
I wouldn't have expected anything else. In this case I can't blame Oracle either. They have a popular product that works. Why cede control? It isn't in their interest to do so. |
| mrider Sep 29, 2010 12:26 PM EDT |
With more than one hundred million users, we believe OpenOffice.org I make no claims of being any kind of a prognosticator - but I predict a mass migration shortly. Oracle is simply too ham-fisted for my taste, and I doubt I'm alone. |
| jdixon Sep 29, 2010 12:41 PM EDT |
> I don't think anyone can judge anything about an office suite from my looks :) Unless it's how many office suites (in the sense of furniture) you've been busy moving lately, I suspect you're correct. :) |
| caitlyn Sep 29, 2010 12:42 PM EDT |
OTOH, if the OOXML support is dropped and the MS Office document compatibility suffers then LibreOffice won't be particularly useful to me. I may not trust OOo but I won't cut my nose to spite my face. I will use the product that works best for me. |
| Bob_Robertson Sep 29, 2010 1:03 PM EDT |
> They have a popular product that works. Why cede control? It isn't in their interest to do so. The way I see the logic, OOo is a cost to Oracle. It isn't sold, so the developer's time is spent money without direct return. It may very well be an element of advertising. When Java was loading its things into Windows, plug-ins, JVM, scripting, etc, Sun put an ad up for OpenOffice with a download button. Actually that's sort of backwards, isn't it? People were already getting Java. OOo was the hanger on. Oracle spending the cost of the in-house OOo developers on sponsoring an independent OOo instead seems to me to be the most logical route. They get Pride of Place of being an original sponsor, they get to look really good for being so gracious in "allowing" the community the name that the community made famous, and they lose only the responsibility for anything that might go sour. |
| bigg Sep 29, 2010 1:47 PM EDT |
> It isn't sold, so the developer's time is spent money without direct return. Oracle does not want companies migrating to Windows. They are smart enough (unlike a lot of other companies) to recognize that competing with Microsoft on the Windows platform is something to avoid. Without a competitor to Office, there will be a lot of migrations to Windows. |
| gus3 Sep 29, 2010 2:25 PM EDT |
caitlyn,Quoting:In this case I can't blame Oracle either. They have a popular product that works.The product may be popular; the product's owner, not so much. After they sued Google over Dalvik, their reputation wound up somwhere between SCO and Congress. And now that I think of it, an argumentum ad populum should help Oracle no more than it should help Microsoft. |
| caitlyn Sep 29, 2010 2:48 PM EDT |
@gus3: Perhaps, but Microsoft still controls 80% of the desktop and 42% of the server room. I still say functionality is what will trump any and all of the other arguments pro and con. Oracle has the resources and the OOo developers to win on that front if they choose to. |
| Bob_Robertson Sep 29, 2010 5:37 PM EDT |
> their reputation wound up somwhere between SCO and Congress. Eeeeeewwwwww. |
| henke54 Oct 04, 2010 1:34 PM EDT |
Quoting:There was a mail sent to the marketing ML by Martin Hollmichel at Oracle:http://user.services.openoffice.org/en/forum/viewtopic.php?f... |
| caitlyn Oct 04, 2010 5:17 PM EDT |
Mr. Hollmichel is absolutely right. Those are two competing products now and I don't see why Oracle should host discussions of a competitor. Makes sense to me. |
| hkwint Oct 04, 2010 8:58 PM EDT |
In a black-and-white world maybe. In the modern era, not everyone who doesn't cooperate with you, is against you (even though some popular leaders believe so). |
| jdixon Oct 04, 2010 9:36 PM EDT |
> In a black-and-white world maybe. Oracle is very much a black and white company. |
| henke54 Oct 04, 2010 10:51 PM EDT |
More news about LibO can be found at the mailinglist forum : http://user.services.openoffice.org/en/forum/viewtopic.php?f... |
| caitlyn Oct 05, 2010 9:16 AM EDT |
The business world is pretty much green in the U.S., not black and white. Supporting a competitor does not help the bottom line. You don't give free support to competing products. |
| jdixon Oct 05, 2010 12:36 PM EDT |
> The business world is pretty much green in the U.S., not black and white. I used the term deliberately, Caitlyn. Black as in "in the black" and white as in "white-out". Oracle is only concerned about being in the black. Anything which Oracle buys and they don't think will make them enough money gets whited-out. Open Office won't make Oracle any money (though it's possible that the renamed Oracle Office will), so don't expect to see a lot of development work on Open Office from Oracle. You can also expect to see the open source edition of VirtualBox to die a slow death. |
| caitlyn Oct 05, 2010 1:49 PM EDT |
Maybe, jdixon, and I can certainly see things going the way you expect. OTOH, if Oracle sees a marketing/sales advantage from giving away an office suite, something likely to have limited revenue potential anyway, they may keep OpenOffice going. Since OpenOffice is a trusted brand already I think you will more like see the name Oracle appended to it rather than an attempt at rebranding. |
| jdixon Oct 05, 2010 2:28 PM EDT |
> ...if Oracle sees a marketing/sales advantage from giving away an office suite, something likely to have limited revenue potential anyway, they may keep OpenOffice going. It's possible, Caitlyn. But it doesn't match Oracle's past actions with other acquisitions, so I wouldn't count on it. |
| Bob_Robertson Oct 05, 2010 3:56 PM EDT |
> I think you will more like see the name Oracle appended to it rather than an attempt at rebranding. OOOo? |
| caitlyn Oct 05, 2010 4:49 PM EDT |
Oooh! Maybe, Bob, maybe :) |
| gus3 Oct 05, 2010 5:34 PM EDT |
"OOOo..." Best said with a sarcastic tone. But, would that mean the fork is called "LOo"? As in, "I'm using the LOo." "The LOo has lots of bugs." It only gets worse from there. |
| caitlyn Oct 05, 2010 5:52 PM EDT |
@gus3: You may have hit on Oracle's marketing strategy to combat LOo. Of course, it would only work in the U.S. for people who know British English. Folks who only speak American would think you were saying Lou and wonder who you were talking about. |
| jdixon Oct 05, 2010 6:40 PM EDT |
> It only gets worse from there.... Yep. Straight down the... > ...it would only work in the U.S. for people who know British English Perhaps unfortunately, quite a few do. :( |
| gus3 Oct 05, 2010 6:52 PM EDT |
Between the Internet and BBC America, the number of Americans aware of Brit slang is probably more than you think. |
| caitlyn Oct 05, 2010 9:25 PM EDT |
BBC America is not part of most basic cable packages. We have a mid-level package and we still don't have it. If we went whole hog for digital cable with HD (and we don't have an HD TV yet, so it's pointless) only then would we get BBC America. I suspect the number of people who really know Brit slang is fewer than you might think. |
| Bob_Robertson Oct 06, 2010 1:07 PM EDT |
Skip to the LOo my darlin! Don't forget that through the 70s and 80s, the best on PBS was recycled BBC shows. Yes, Minister..... |
| gus3 Oct 06, 2010 1:23 PM EDT |
Dave Allen at Large, Monty Python, The Two Ronnies... We still see Are You Being Served around here. |
| bigg Oct 06, 2010 1:53 PM EDT |
Fawlty Towers was one of the all-time great comedies. (I think that was BBC.) Too bad they made only 12 episodes. |
| Steven_Rosenber Oct 06, 2010 2:26 PM EDT |
LOo jokes aside, Oracle bought Sun for the hardware business, Solaris, Java and MySQL. I don't think they're in the mood to throw resources at an office suite. |
| ComputerBob Oct 06, 2010 2:27 PM EDT |
Mr. Bean FTW. |
| Koriel Oct 07, 2010 7:43 PM EDT |
Maybe Vermont is different but a lot of folks i know around here are quite familiar with Brit slang and are perfectly able to understand me, whether im having a sly suck on a fag, dropping a brick in the loo, i do get some odd looks on occasion but its fun seeing some of the expressions on folks faces :) |
| TxtEdMacs Oct 07, 2010 9:40 PM EDT |
Quoting:dropping a brick in the loo,Which means British porcelain is much better than what we get in the States. YBT P.S. What we use bricks it's to reduce water usage, by putting one or two in the water cabinet. However, we would never think of using the brick you have in mind for that purpose. |
| gus3 Oct 07, 2010 9:43 PM EDT |
MBT: A jug (EDIT: filled with water) works as well as a brick, if you put a few stones in the bottom to weigh it down. (All bad multi-cultural puns most definitely intended.) |
| TxtEdMacs Oct 07, 2010 11:01 PM EDT |
gus, If you insist on jugging it, why not fill it with water*? If you are an overly conservative type and fear the water will escape scuppering your conservation efforts, put a lid on it. YBT * With or without Stones to stem the flotation you seem to fear. |
| hkwint Oct 07, 2010 11:05 PM EDT |
As far as I understood: The Dutch OpenOffice company already existied before Sun made a free version of StarOffice, so therefore it's OpenOffice.org. Both LibreOffice and Oracle OpenOffice can be distinguished from the Dutch OpenOffice company, so there's no need to append "org" or a small o. So, there's OOo in nomans-land - will be dead soon (while Oracle bricks [on] it?), LO and OOO. Not that hard. |
| gus3 Oct 07, 2010 11:08 PM EDT |
MBT, correct as usual. I should have stated so explicitly, instead of assuming the reader understood. Edited to reflect this. |
| TxtEdMacs Oct 08, 2010 7:45 AM EDT |
Quoting: [...] correct as usualMe? I am torn, which is better? What are you drinking or are you on Crack? Perhaps it's your reading comprehension at fault, otherwise how can I understand such an addled remark? So sober up and edit that comment before it is seen too widely*. I have my reputation to consider. How can you say that I know what I am talking about when I assiduously avoid factual basis to my conversations and assertions? YBT * Or horrors, indexed. |
| caitlyn Oct 08, 2010 8:29 AM EDT |
hkwint: I wouldn't bet on OOo being "dead soon." I wouldn't bet against it either. It all depends on what value Oracle assigns to it. Unless, of course, you have some inside information you wish to share. @Koriel: Years ago one of my coworkers was a recent British immigrant. I still remember the reaction he got when he said, "I could die for a fag." Then he realized the difference between the British and American meanings of the word and stammered out an explanation. It was clear some of the Americans did not know the British usage. |
| hkwint Oct 08, 2010 10:36 PM EDT |
Caitlyn: Like most of the times, you're right. I think Schrödinger would agree the faith of OOo is "undiceded" at this moment, because the box is still pretty much closed. Only after it opened - meaning after Oracle spoke out or their decisions show - we know if it's still alive or not. Ken Starks (alias helios) had some inside information I believe, as how to Oracle was not going to do anything for OOo anymore. Like with most interesting news, I didn't bookmark it, so not sure where it went. But if neither Oracle nor the community is contributing to OOo, I'd say it's dying. Of course, we don't know if rumours are true though. |
| tuxchick Oct 08, 2010 10:53 PM EDT |
--placeholder to keep thread going-- |
| hkwint Oct 08, 2010 11:27 PM EDT |
So finally I collected some evidence TC is a bot, ahem. |
| tuxchick Oct 08, 2010 11:40 PM EDT |
A convincing bot, you must admit. |
| caitlyn Oct 09, 2010 12:26 AM EDT |
A most interesting bot with a gift for language. |
| hkwint Oct 09, 2010 1:40 AM EDT |
Yeah, you're even better than Boten Anna! |
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